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Making survivors side more challenging


cecurity

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(edited)

I like the gun control talk XD

 

I agree with Jackie nerfing AK. I had no idea that it does almost double the dmg compare to other rifles. Making the price accordingly would make a lot of sense too. But I still hate cheap Fireworks, Gas Can, Molov, Bile and Pipe etc. I miss the day normal zombies can come and scratch our backs after we got boomed. Nowadays there are just 10 lasers scanning the sky, daring any flies they don't agree with crossing their sight. A SI, mainly boomer can only dream of landing any where close to 10 assault rifles with laser on. Even if it succeed some one will always have that firework or molov ready.

 

Is it even possible to limit assault rifles on most late stages since it usually come with those? I am curious if limiting 4 per team would add more depth to the game. You get to manage your scarce resources, making team formation and helping teammates more important.

Edited by cecurity
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Limiting the amount of assault rifles seems unfair. People will be flamed for taking one when a better player is on their team without one.

 

Yeah, there would be a lot of fighting over the weapons.

 

De-lasering the server would nerf things a little bit. Probably a better route.

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Limiting the amount of assault rifles seems unfair. People will be flamed for taking one when a better player is on their team without one

 

That's what I like though. Chaotic, messy and, bit*hing XD

 

De-lasering can also work. But it won't have the same effect as those big guns are still much better than Tier 1 weapons. Some Stage 3 may not be designed for Tier 1 Weps as they are more difficult. But I feel like they aren't made for 10 big rifles either. And it always ruin Stage 2 when survivors can get their hands on them early.

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Getting rid of fire for the Survivors would go the farthest to evening things out. Nerfing a single gun won't stop most of the regulars from dominating.

 

They'll simply shoot 5 bullets to kill instead of 3. Kill SI's in 1.5 seconds instead of 1.

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By the way, this is the weapon script for the AK47. All other guns would have a similar script:

 

WeaponData
{
// Terror-specific Data --------------------
"VerticalPunch" "2"
"SpreadPerShot" "1.6"
"MaxSpread" "35"
"SpreadDecay" "7"
"MinDuckingSpread" "0.5"
"MinStandingSpread" "1"
"MinInAirSpread" "3"
"MaxMovementSpread" "6"
"AddonAttachment" "primary"
"Team"	 "Survivor"

"Tier"	 "2" // valid entries are 0, 1, 2

"ResponseRulesName" "Rifle_AK47"
// particle muzzle flash effect to play when fired
"MuzzleFlashEffect_1stPerson" "weapon_muzzle_flash_smg_FP"
"MuzzleFlashEffect_3rdPerson" "weapon_muzzle_flash_smg"
// model for the shell casing to eject when we fire bullets
"EjectBrassEffect" "weapon_shell_casing_rifle"

// Used in the music system when this weapon fires
"MusicDynamicSpeed" "0.35"

"DisplayName" "#L4D_Weapon_Rifle_AK47"
"DisplayNameAllCaps" "#L4D_Weapon_Rifle_AK47_CAPS"

"NewInL4D2" "1"
// 360 Terror Data
"MaxAutoAimDeflection1" "10.0"
"MaxAutoAimRange1" "0"
//This value determins how "big" a target is for auto aim. If a target is 10.0 units big then it is considered 10.0*scale.
//You can think about this value controlling a falloff value on distant targets, the smaller the value the harder it is to hit at a distance.
"WeaponAutoAimScale" "1.0"
// End Terror-specific Data ----------------
"Rumble" "4"
"MaxPlayerSpeed" "230"
"WeaponType" "rifle"
"WeaponPrice" "3100"
"WeaponArmorRatio" "1.4"
"CrosshairMinDistance" "4"
"CrosshairDeltaDistance" "3"
"BuiltRightHanded" "1"
"PlayerAnimationExtension" "m4"
"CanEquipWithShield" "0"


// Weapon characteristics:
"PenetrationNumLayers" "2"
"PenetrationPower" "50"
"PenetrationMaxDistance" "0" // none
"Damage" "58" //was 33
"Range" "3000"
"RangeModifier" "0.97"
"GainRange" "1500" // range at which to use a gain curve to fall off to zero
"Bullets" "1"
"CycleTime" "0.13" //fire rate
"TimeToIdle" "1.5"
"IdleInterval" "60"

// Weapon data is loaded by both the Game and Client DLLs.
"printname" "Assault Rifle"
"playermodel" "models/w_models/weapons/w_rifle_ak47.mdl"

"viewmodel" "models/v_models/v_rifle_AK47.mdl"
"CharacterViewmodelAddon"
{
"Coach" "models/weapons/arms/v_arms_coach_new.mdl"
"Mechanic" "models/weapons/arms/v_arms_mechanic_new.mdl"
"Producer" "models/weapons/arms/v_arms_producer_new.mdl"
"Gambler" "models/weapons/arms/v_arms_gambler_new.mdl"

"Manager"	 "models/weapons/arms/v_arms_louis.mdl"
"Biker"	 "models/weapons/arms/v_arms_francis.mdl"
"TeenGirl" "models/weapons/arms/v_arms_zoey.mdl"
"NamVet"	 "models/weapons/arms/v_arms_bill.mdl"
}
"anim_prefix" "anim"
"bucket" "0"
"bucket_position" "0"
"clip_size" "40" //was 50

"primary_ammo" "AMMO_TYPE_ASSAULTRIFLE"
"secondary_ammo" "None"
"weight" "25"
"item_flags" "0"
"LoadoutSlots" "2"
// Sounds for the weapon. There is a max of 16 sounds per category (i.e. max 16 "single_shot" sounds)
SoundData
{
"single_shot" "AK47.Fire"
"shoot_incendiary" "AK47.FireIncendiary"
}
// Weapon Sprite data is loaded by the Client DLL.
TextureData
{
"weapon"
{
"file" "vgui/hud/iconsheet2"
"x" "128"
"y" "384"
"width" "192"
"height" "64"
}
"ammo"
{
"file" "vgui/hud/iconsheet"
"x" "384"
"y" "448"
"width" "64"
"height" "64"
}
"crosshair"
{
"file" "sprites/crosshairs"
"x" "0"
"y" "48"
"width" "24"
"height" "24"
}
"autoaim"
{
"file" "sprites/crosshairs"
"x" "0"
"y" "48"
"width" "24"
"height" "24"
}
}
ModelBounds
{
Viewmodel
{
Mins "-10 -2 -13"
Maxs "30 10 0"
}
World
{
Mins "-8 -9 -6"
Maxs "29 9 8"
}
}
}

 

Also note that changing the clip size results in goofy reloading when hitting your reload key when the gun is already fully loaded. Also, editing the bullet spread doesn't really seem to work either.

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Why not just limit the amount of heals a survivor can use, most good players are instantly able to buy up, myself including. Survivors would have to be smart on the times they use their limited heals. Nerfing weapons wouldn't be a problem for me, at all. I'm not the best player, but I can farm a good amount of points in the first few minutes of a map easily, most good players can. You could also limit the amount of points a player can recieve from others, I see people always sending points out to good players to have them quickly buy themselves up.

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Yea that sounds interesting. Except the fact it may be hard to keep track who has used their limited self-heals, I think it will add depth to the game because the best players will be forced to rearrange their positions with their teammates, and thus not seeing the same players watching all other survivors' backs, eliminating points hoarding, and presenting us a reason for other good players to step up instead of wandering around.

 

But we are getting better overall and the game needs more challenge. Beside agreeing nerfing AK, maybe we can increase dmg for general zombies. Not one hit incapped like they have in Expert Mode, although it can be fun XD. Maybe just starts with 10 times the current dmg dealt. Cheap throwables still need to be gone though.

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Well what about limiting for buying health for SI, especially charger? Now it's 3, at least for charger should be 5 or 6. If Jackie would decrease the AK damage, then we all know it's not easy to take charger down unless headshooting him

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When I was tinkering around with the weapon file, changing the weapon spread didn't do crap which was disappointing. I'm thinking about reducing the damage to be 20% higher than the M4 and making it's fire rate a tad slower.

 

Once I do change it though, the server would have to be restarted for it to take effect.

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Purchasable hordes should be in chem suits so they're immune to fire, that way buying a horde becomes useful again. Will also make it harder for survivors.

 

Getting rid of gifts would also help, survivors don't really need any more points.

Edited by Limi
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Purchasable hordes should be in chem suits so they're immune to fire, that way buying a horde becomes useful again. Will also make it harder for survivors.

 

Getting rid of gifts would also help, survivors don't really need any more points.

 

Or a submenu that lets you pick the type of horde.

 

A horde of riot cops would be tough.

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I'm not buffing the Tank.

 

I could try to simply nerf the AK47 though. Not by price, but other means. As it stands now, it's damage per bullet, is 58 while the regular assault rifle is 33.

 

Could we please leave the fire-rate alone....If we are reducing the damage,37-40 should be acceptable is my opinion....but the fire rate leave it the same please.

 

Afterall, AK is supposed to be a powerful weapon and better than the M16

 

Another idea is to allow fire crates, only when a tank is alive and increase the AK price to 9 maybe ?

Edited by Avengers
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Why not add other small benefits that help the infected as a whole? I love buying the options that help my entire team beyond mere class availability. Horde and witch on respawn can be useful, but I'd like to see a couple more options added to the list. I'd absolutely love to see a menu purchase that would cause all SI to bleed acid upon death, spitter-style.

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I think that would screw with the director Tank since 2 need to be spawned by the director for the rescue vehicle to arrive. If the director sees that there is a Tank alive, it will hold off it's own game progressing Tank until the current Tank is dealt with, and if one spawns immediately after that, the wait may be indefinite.

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There's some complaints about round lasting forever because ppl keep defibbing. They just don't care or can't assess the impact on the score at that moment. However: how about 50 points: tank on respawn? (after horde on respawn and witch on respawn have been bought).

 

Could make you think twice about defibbing that guy, especially if it's not a main. If it is, you might want to risk it.

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There's some complaints about round lasting forever because ppl keep defibbing. They just don't care or can't assess the impact on the score at that moment. However: how about 50 points: tank on respawn? (after horde on respawn and witch on respawn have been bought).

 

Could make you think twice about defibbing that guy, especially if it's not a main. If it is, you might want to risk it.

 

I actually really like the sound of that

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You know how unfair it would be to have Tanks on Respawn? If they're down half a team, there would be both no point in continuing forward, or defibbing to get a better chance in making it forward.

 

True, it would...but how about tank respawn on every 3 or 5 defibs ?

Also this tank could have reduced health than normal spawns...so easy to kill for people knowing what to do and its challenging. On the other hand infected get to keep up the pressure

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You know how unfair it would be to have Tanks on Respawn? If they're down half a team, there would be both no point in continuing forward, or defibbing to get a better chance in making it forward.

 

Then up the points total - the intention is to finish them off quickly anyways.

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You know how unfair it would be to have Tanks on Respawn? If they're down half a team, there would be both no point in continuing forward, or defibbing to get a better chance in making it forward.

 

I don't really understand what you mean here. Why would it be unfair? It just makes the survivors' choice to defib that much more risky, as opposed to now where there is no risk. Another way would be to raise points for a defib (30 points for example, just like the revive).

 

Why would there be no point in continuing forward?

And why wouldn't defibbing give you a better chance of moving on?

 

Sorry, i just don't understand what you mean.

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