Nerf the hunter

[crasx]

I don't understand why people place self worth on an arbitrary unscientific points system

[Elias]

I think 10 points for max dp is good enough and should be left alone... Other than that just buff the rest of the infected if you guys wanna complain.

[EliteGandalf]

 

 

I don't understand why people place self worth on an arbitrary unscientific points system

 

It isn't about the points. Even if you are not a competitive gamer you should be able to see that. It's about the rush. 

 

@Johnny 25% is more of 12.5 is more than fair. It would lower the max pounce points awarded to somewhere between 9 - 10

[crasx]

If its not about the points why does it matter if we reduce them?

 

If we made rocket jockies 25 points would you become a master at those?

 

This just all seems like elitism which I guess shouldn't surprise me 

[EliteGandalf]

If its not about the points why does it matter if we reduce them?

 

If we made rocket jockies 25 points would you become a master at those?

 

This just all seems like elitism which I guess shouldn't surprise me 

 

Points earned for actions executed fuels the rush. Would I become a master jockey? Yea! Would I be the best at it? Probably not, every class has it's master. I simply aim to be on par with them, that's good enough.

 

The "Elite" is simply a clan tag from my C.O.D. days. nothing more. I actually prefer to be referred to as Gandalf

[anzul]

 

 

If we made rocket jockies 25 points would you become a master at those?

 

...yes. its not that hard realy.

they automayicaly latch onto close by survivors aniway.

 

 

 

I don't understand why people place self worth on an arbitrary unscientific points system

 

 

This just all seems like elitism which I guess shouldn't surprise me 

 

crasx, please tell me where are people being mean/elitist/rude. 

because i realy feel like im missing something that should be obvious

[lordbaby]

- im not promoting this, and i dont need to take advantage of this, but since many mentioned about the get up animation, let's not forget the get up animation happens in the spit/charge and many other situation too (can easily get plenty of points and able to attack more than one player), you won't wait till the person get up and free and then spit when the player is getting charge/end of charge. i will see it as a coordination/teamwork thing especially in a 4v4 game. if we nerf something based on a certain situation, it will be fair to nerf everything else in a similar situation.  Nerfing one thing and buffing another doesnt sound balance.

 

- the community is not competitive (but doesn't mean you need to make it amateur), plus there is a point being state that hunters pouncing is too easy, so easy it needed to be nerf .. so the two things are contradicted 

 

- the community is not competitive, nor amateur necessary, but one thing i can be sure is that, it heavily promotes teamwork, what can take out the tank easily? Teamwork. That's why i dont want to nerf the hunter juz because it helps a player get tank fast, it somehow takes away the chance for the survivor to show/improve teamwork. Many long time players still position themselves in a bad spot to fight tank (even few steps behind or ahead can make big differences). If tank have to wipe out the team, at least we want to see a good fight before it happens. i actually like games where we kill 6 or 7 tanks before teams get wipe out rather than making to the safe room (of koz making it will be a plus). Getting to the safe room is always not a guarantee and it does not ever mean it is because this or that. 

 

- new players, simply tip them what not to do, i'd be happy to tell them to watch out.

 

- one thing i can agree without much thoughts -- you guys can nerf the hunter (same for other classes) if it is pouncing a bot.

 

- one more thing i wanna pt out - 9 out of 10 times it wasnt the hunter that is imbalanced .. it is the team. you dont blame a si or whatever because the team isnt balance

[lordbaby]

 

The "Elite" is simply a clan tag from my C.O.D. days. nothing more. I actually prefer to be referred to as Gandalf

 

 

i took my clan tag out because people think it is something else -_-'

[zero0]

............................and another game turned into a suck fest...................nerf the hunter

Edited April 22, 2016 by zero0

[stabz0r]

............................and another game turned into a suck fest...................nerf the hunter

 

Time to play DirtyBomb, zero0.

[Vilkys]

............................and another game turned into a suck fest...................nerf the hunter

Cut the points in half, people will still get pounced regardless of how many points you lower it.

 

Basically you want to remove the hunter altogether because of your inability to look up for hunters, yeah its the hunters fault for survivors not sticking to the basic and most simple of things, look up and dodge. At least that's the feeling I get from this thread.

Edited April 22, 2016 by Vilkys

[Architect]

 

............................and another game turned into a suck fest...................nerf the hunter

Cut the points in half, people will still get pounced regardless of how many points you lower it.

 

Basically you want to remove the hunter altogether because of your inability to look up for hunters, yeah its the hunters fault for survivors not sticking to the basic and most simple of things, look up and dodge. At least that's the feeling I get from this thread.

 

 

No one is talking about taking the hunter away.  No one wants to reduce the amount of damage a hunter does.  The only thing that is being discussed is reducing the amount of points that a hunter produces.  Think of it in a Warcraft frame of mind I guess.  DPS.  A hunter, in many peoples opinion has a higher DPI than any other infected class.  Agreed there is a skill to being able to regularly get those types of pounces.  However, in many people's opinions, it throws the balance of the game off.  If you get a team with one or two good pouncers vs a team with good jockeys and boomers, it is no contest, the hunter team will have the tank first.

 

I have made my views on this apparent prior to this thread.  I think the combination of being able to "jump off of nothing but sky" and the big points provided by the pounce is out of balance.  Since no one wants to upset anyone and say that pouncing off of invisible walls is an exploit, then we are left with talking about the points.

[crasx]

 

I have made my views on this apparent prior to this thread.  I think the combination of being able to "jump off of nothing but sky" and the big points provided by the pounce is out of balance.  Since no one wants to upset anyone and say that pouncing off of invisible walls is an exploit, then we are left with talking about the points.

 

We had that discussion before. I think its bogus. other people say its part of the game. one problem with it is there are no equivalents to jumping off invisible walls for other classes. You can't master being a spitter or jockie or even boomer. Like really what is the point of being anything other than a hunter (besides you know, actually being able to win a round)

 

 

 

crasx, please tell me where are people being mean/elitist/rude. 

Quite a few people actually. I deal with elitism all day. annoys the heck out of me and just makes me look down on people

[EliteGandalf]

 

 

I have made my views on this apparent prior to this thread.

Sometime after my last post I was referred to prior posts about the hunter that I honestly knew nothing about. In the hopes of not re-opening closed wounds I won't quote anything I've read.

 

If there is to more nerf'n I ask again for a reasonable suggestion. Please keep in mind 12.5 was not always the points awarded from a 25dp. It was 12, and as minuscule as that may seem, someone had to think that 12 wasn't enough. It raised points awarded from pouncing incaps from 6 to 6.7 which in my eyes made it all the more worth pouncing incaps (though I never do on purpose). 25% off 12.5 would changed the max points given in one instance from 12.5 to slightly more than 9. Like 9.1. This effectively changes the amount of pounces needed to gain tank points from 3 to about 5. At 12.5 a pounce 6 pounces would give you almost 100pts. 25% moves the class from a front runner in my opinion to being on par with the rest. That is a reasonable amount.

 

Lowering beyond 25% makes the classes a bit useless. The amount of points awarded for the max attack would not be worth it. If it is to be lowered more can we implent not allowing spitters to spit in elevators, boomers not to be able to boom clusters of people in elevators, etc.? Could the damage awarded from pounces be increased? *Example: What ever the default distance is for 25dp if you are higher and land you do more damage? In my opinion the max damage delivered should be no greater than 100.*

 

I'm not taking a position of being unreasonable, nor I'm I speaking for everyone that plays the hunter class. Comments are welcome from all. I would love to hear what everyone thinks especially people that don't normally *or ever for that matter* post. 

[anzul]

 

 

Quite a few people actually. I deal with elitism all day. annoys the heck out of me and just makes me look down on people

but in this thread? 

the most i've seen is people being 'loud' about their opinions, but certainly not elitist or rude.

[veee]

 

............................and another game turned into a suck fest...................nerf the hunter

Cut the points in half, people will still get pounced regardless of how many points you lower it.

 

Basically you want to remove the hunter altogether because of your inability to look up for hunters, yeah its the hunters fault for survivors not sticking to the basic and most simple of things, look up and dodge. At least that's the feeling I get from this thread.

 

 

play csgo with me. <3

[JackieChan]

 

I have made my views on this apparent prior to this thread.

If there is to more nerf'n I ask again for a reasonable suggestion. Please keep in mind 12.5 was not always the points awarded from a 25dp. It was 12, and as minuscule as that may seem, someone had to think that 12 wasn't enough.

 

 

It increased from 12 to 12.5 because of the addition to allowing for float points instead of just whole numbers.  Was also in the addition to assist points for Survivors.  I honestly think that the Hunter nerf is solid and doesn't cripple the class too much as far as point earning goes.  Yes, Smokers/Jockeys are still the gimped point earners, but they are also the most vulnerable.  I'm still trying to think up a good balance for one, or both.

 

Also, regarding the whole invisible walls thing is how brushes are handled.  A textured brush is the same as a nodraw brush (not textured) and thus gets treated the same way as far as collision goes...thus allows for Hunters to pounce off of them.  Same with ceilings.  No way is no way to combat it either.  The more a Hunter is pouncing around, the more exposed they are thus the more of a target they become with their loud pouncing sound.  Every SI class has a situational benefit to their attacks...it's just that Hunters have the most out of every other one.  Every outdoor area is a hazard for players vs Hunters because they could pounce in from anywhere.  Other SI really only have corners they can pop out from, thus limiting their situational asset.  Teamwork also has to be utilized more for other SI because you have to time attacks well, whereas Hunters can just be a lone-wolf since they're putting themselves the furthest away from their target.  The teamwork factor I see with Hunters is that if they're chain pouncing a target, it requires teamwork from both sides.  Survivors have to guard the target whereas the Infected have to distract them from picking off incoming SI.  Sure, Hunters can get a Tank the fastest, but I view it hugely as a risk/reward scenario.

[Mercman]

if i help a charger get a death charge i get nothing as a smoker and the charger gets 5 points for a death charge . A hunter ponces and gets12 points   Whats wrong with this picture?

 

Smokers dont need more points they need longer tongues and they need to move

 

And i think the smoker under the map is just in a invisible caves equates to hunters jumping on the sky

 

Hunters are like the Wind

they ****

boomers get way too many points also. They should get .5 point from the boom and the rest of the points from the common attack

 

The  "good" players care more about their ppm then killing the survivors   That should change.

Point W****S ruin this game

Edited April 22, 2016 by Mercman

[Vilkys]

 

Like 9.1. This effectively changes the amount of pounces needed to gain tank points from 3 to about 5. At 12.5 a pounce 6 pounces would give you almost 100pts. 25% moves the class from a front runner in my opinion to being on par with the rest. That is a reasonable amount.

Lowering beyond 25% makes the classes a bit useless. The amount of points awarded for the max attack would not be worth it. If it is to be lowered more can we implent not allowing spitters to spit in elevators, boomers not to be able to boom clusters of people in elevators, etc.? Could the damage awarded from pounces be increased? *Example: What ever the default distance is for 25dp if you are higher and land you do more damage? In my opinion the max damage delivered should be no greater than 100.*

 

 

I can agree to getting 9 points max per 25 damage pounce since it would give survivors more of a survival chance but increasing the damage is a bit much since the survivor take 10-25 more damage after getting pounced for a total of 35-50 damage if not more if it's not cleared fast enough.

Edited April 22, 2016 by Vilkys

[anzul]

Yes, Smokers/Jockeys are still the gimped point earners, but they are also the most vulnerable

maybe give them more hp and speed? faster reloading for the smoker too. 

 

they need longer tongues and they need to move

plz no, when aiming at a group there would be a greater chance of picking up the people in front instead of the last one.

also, depending on the lenthg of the tounge it could be abused in areas where the smoker has to be sneaky to drag down survivors.

Edited April 22, 2016 by anzul

[Architect]

 

Yes, Smokers/Jockeys are still the gimped point earners, but they are also the most vulnerable

maybe give them more hp and speed? faster reloading for the smoker too.

they need longer tongues and they need to move

plz no, when aiming at a group there would be a greater chance of picking up the people in front instead of the last one.

also, depending on the lenthg of the tounge it could be abused in areas where the smoker has to be sneaky to drag down survivors.

Smoker has to be sneaky like the hunter has to find good pounce points without relying on invisible walls?

[zero0]

 

............................and another game turned into a suck fest...................nerf the hunter

Cut the points in half, people will still get pounced regardless of how many points you lower it.

 

Basically you want to remove the hunter altogether because of your inability to look up for hunters, yeah its the hunters fault for survivors not sticking to the basic and most simple of things, look up and dodge. At least that's the feeling I get from this thread.

 

 

No I have NEVER EVER said that in the 100 times I have posted in this thread. I'm sorry that new players and bots don't read your suggestions on just side stepping hunters and if you had read my suggestion, you would agree that you would get to hunt MORE of these incompetent bots and new players.  If you haven't taken the time to read my posts then please don't respond to them and have discourse over arguments I have NOT made.  It distracts from the discussion at hand.

[EliteGandalf]

 

 

And i think the smoker under the map is just in a invisible caves equates to hunters jumping on the sky

You can see the hunter most of the time though I will admit that in areas you can climb beyond the sight rendering distance. Smokers under the map can not been seen, and it is impossible to tell the distance from the tongue to the actual smoker itself. Do I have a problem with it? No. It is actual quite funny to me honestly.

 

 

 

boomers get way too many points also.

 

Boom 20 survivors at 1.79 a person = 35.8. Even with *Stomach Acid* and *Group Shower* you are still short of tanks points. The boomer power relies on survivors clustering and not putting down fire on boomed survivors. Even if you don't skeet, if survivors don't group up and use fire like people do on the tanks, boomers are effectively nerf'd that way.

 

 

 

Smokers dont need more points they need longer tongues and they need to move

Longer tongues I'm cool with, and being able to move? I lol'd I'm cool with that too as long as they weren't able to move as fast as the jockey. I don't know about everyone else though. Everytime topics like jockey's being able to jump with a survivors, or moving smokers are brought up they seem to be dismissed because it isn't vanilla enough.

 

 

 

The  "good" players care more about their ppm then killing the survivors   That should change. Point W****S ruin this game

The *PW's* use hunters to get tanks and kills survivors. Isn't that what this post is about?

 

After taking in all the input from the individuals that posted I feel the general consenses is not that it is easy to pounce, more so that it is easy pickins for those that can pounce. The current point system is fine as is. The problem lies elsewhere. Someone told me in-game that my tryhard ruined the game. Ruined it for you? It made it fun for me. What am I saying here? Imagine playing Infestation in the past, when there were only pvp servers. What if someone wanted to play the game and just run around with friends being a bambi and killing zombies. They lacked the interest in being good enough to pvp. Imagine H1Z1 with only battle royal servers. It is *my opinion* that one of the servers should be completely revamped as to better meet the needs of what people are asking for here. It doesn't have to happen instantly. I know that Jackie is a busy person. It doesn't have to be perfect, but I do ask that suggestions offerred here be taken into consideration. I remember a time when times were bogged down by chargers, spitters, and boomers inside building. That doesn't happen nearly enough anymore.

 

My suggestion is to leave one server completely as it is, and adjust another server to meet the needs of players that do not play for ppm. After all some people play for the social experience that gc offers and the teamwork accomplished from it, not everyone plays for the ppm. If there is any interest in this, anyone curious to more suggestion along this line of thought, I could provide in-depth some ideas towards balance in the teamwork, point distribution, and points awarded. Didn't want to continue talking about it if there isn't any interest.

[Vilkys]

No I have NEVER EVER said that in the 100 times I have posted in this thread. I'm sorry that new players and bots don't read your suggestions on just side stepping hunters and if you had read my suggestion, you would agree that you would get to hunt MORE of these incompetent bots and new players. If you haven't taken the time to read my posts then please don't respond to them and have discourse over arguments I have NOT made. It distracts from the discussion at hand.

I sorry if I misread your post(I may have in all honesty).

 

True there will be more pounces, but then people will get annoyed(for a lack of a better wording) and will probably end up leaving the game.

Edited April 22, 2016 by Vilkys

[Architect]

 

And i think the smoker under the map is just in a invisible caves equates to hunters jumping on the sky

You can see the hunter most of the time though I will admit that in areas you can climb beyond the sight rendering distance. Smokers under the map can not been seen, and it is impossible to tell the distance from the tongue to the actual smoker itself. Do I have a problem with it? No. It is actual quite funny to me honestly.

 

 

I never meant smokers under a map.  That is an exploit.  I was referring to new opportunities that would be open to a smoke with a longer reach.  I can hide, but in some places I cannot reach the survivors because they don't go near the area.  That is all I meant.