MurderinClony

Wonder if Johhny wants to put up the 4 achieves I got in a row from just one kill sometime soon. xD

Heh, the first floor was pretty close to being perfectly aligned, except for one room next to the shotgun, thats about it.

One thing you could have done was taken some graph paper and made a quick prototype to work with, 1 grid being something like a 2x2 square on the editor.

But like you said, and I know this well since I am becoming a programmer myself, it got too hard, but in reality, laziness took over. :3

Heh, no problem man, thats the whole thing with playtesters xD At least we find them for you now, rather than later.

And good, Im glad you didn't take the time to actually make that whole intricate maze 

Edit: Oh i just noticed, you change effects based on the weapon you have... Very nice idea.

Edit2: When going out on the balcony, from one side it tints the screen to night, and the other entrance leaves it day.

Edit3: Jackie, your dungeon is the only dungeon that Ive actually had to make a physical map for, Im not done yet but when I get off work.... Ill finish your dungeon, one way or the other.

I do really hope you didnt make that whole ice cave man, I really hope that was a dungeon generator like the game stated.

Edit: I think I found a perpetual room. Trying not to spoil anything while I explain but its where there is a fireplace and your dude makes a "Board" joke. I went in, but I cannot get back out and I have searched the whole room, got the shotgun too, still says to keep searching when I go to leave.

Alright give me a bit to see whatchu got. Im making my own game as well, with the same creator, maybe I can grab some ideas from yours Jackie xD

Edit: One quick thing Ill say, nothing yet about the gameplay, but some of the stairs or exits may want to be turned to "player touch" instead? I didnt exactly think I had to press my action button to go up the stairs in the inn of hammerport, and I got stuck inside wandering around for a bit xD

I do like the Body Heat meter in the ice cave, annoying as it is, I like the "tension" it adds, also like that there is more than just 1 stage of it too.

Huh. I just tried it and it skips right to the credits.

Lying does help your argument you know Carlos?

According to the L4D2 stats pages hosted by GC themselves, you have used 1500 more hunters than boomers. Nice try though. I thought I would leave out how I skeet you quite often in matches.

But I am really curious if you even read anything I post to this forum, you like to jump to conclusions based off the first few words.

I gave you a suggestion, I never told you to stop playing tank. I said: "If you are concerned about letting your team down as a tank" and I gave you a suggestion on what you could do instead. 

I also did not single you out when I talked about points, I said "you and a lot of the other hunters" from multiple posts in the past asking for hunter points to be dumbed downed and the likes. 

By the way, if you focused more on arguing your point instead of making smart remarks, maybe you could get somewhere with me.

Nor did I. I said they will never change.

Well then this accomplishes what you want from the boomer bile points going up. Not only do they buy a bile jar but now they have bought a molotov, gascan, or fireworks crate as well. They used a boomer bile for 6 or however much it is and then added more onto it with one of those three.

If you retreat to a high spot or behind cover, chances are the survivors won't follow you to bile you again, simply because they could be caught by other infected and hurt their team. 

The only time you will get double biled or even tripled is if you have committed your tank and are not falling back. To which the effects of the bile are not that bad considering you already have a survivor in you sight, and even when biled you still push after that one person. This is the same situation if you are not biled. You attack the group but always single out one player in order to get hits at least. This reveals your back to all the survivors that have split off and are already shooting you, regardless of a bile jar on you or not.

To this I would like to say though: if you are holding back or hiding for a bit throwing a few rocks, most survivors will throw molotovs instead of biles. Let me reword that. If you are throwing rocks from a distance, which I hope you do, then the only people who will attempt anything at all will be the "good" players, those who know they can angle the throw and get the hit. Along with that, they will be throwing molotovs and not bile jars. Once the molotov hits and they actually hit you, then they pop a bile jar on you if you come down to attack.

I'm not sure what your argument is for at this point either. For the first one you say its no longer fun yet the second one you don't want to let your team down.

That is correct. Because no matter how much they cost, I will still play on this server. Points only add to the experience of this server, they don't make or break it.

And if you were to actually read this then you might understand what was actually said.

But let me reword that as well to be more clear: When everyone on your team is playing hunter trying to get a tank and wipe the team, its hilarious when the other team walks right into the saferoom because nothing is slowing them down because everyone is playing hunter and nothing else.

Nowhere do I say I laugh at infected when they fail.

Let me add this for closing thoughts too Carlos.

If you are concerned about letting your team down as a tank, then stop trying to be a hunter to get those three pounces and then a tank, only to get biled and come make this post. Play charger or spitter and get points for support for a tank that has more confidence.

Sadly you and a lot of the other hunters are only playing the hunter for points, and not for what he is really for.

I'm going to let you in on some information real quick Carlos.

First off, the Boomer Bile Jar was made by Valve and the creators of Left 4 Dead 2. That boomer bile on a tank is supposed to make him blind, its just like if the survivor got puked on, that's the whole point. Deal with it.

This above fact and the fact that the GC servers are heavily vanilla servers with very little changes to core game mechanics, some damage and range have been upped but all standards are still in place, will lead me to believe that this bile on a tank will never change.

If you say you are an experienced tank, then you should be expecting the Bile Jars and Molotovs. I will not tell you tactics to avoid Bile Jars nor Molotovs but you can do both, even if you are hit by a Bile Jar you can hide, easily. As for commons hitting you, you can run in a tiny little circle to avoid them. The commons rarely hit you and can only hit you if you sit still for more than a second, so that's an unreasonable argument right there.

As for the lose-lose situation, you are completely wrong.

First off, the Bile Jar brings zombies.

Second, the those zombies which are still alive and should be because you have no reason to kill them since avoiding them is as simple as holding 'W' and running around in circles, will go after the survivors when you are no longer Biled, especially if other survivors are biled.

Third, I have personally biled a tank as a survivor and our entire team got wiped. I have also been on the other end of that as well, got biled and wrecked the survivors. It is only a small setback, get out of the line of fire and hide behind enough walls or an object so bullets do not hit you.

Fourth, when you are biled on, the survivors know your location and will generally focus more on you, which gives all your infected buddies an advantage, because most survivors are shooting the tank and nothing else.

There are plenty of wins on your side when you get biled, mainly the extra common the survivors deal with, they bring a horde for you, you dont even need a boomer nor do you have to buy one.

By the way, if you are throwing rocks you should almost always be on a higher spot than the survivors and out of their range, if you are throwing rocks while in sight of the survivors, that is your fault if you get biled because they spotted you.

The frustration meter is made to make you go in, or if you are good enough you can delay that.

Let me explain the point of the throwables: they are all situational and have their own advantages and disadvantages. They are not made to combat what the others do not.

Pipebomb 

Advantage: Great against a horde and eliminating lots of infected quickly after only a short build up time, mainly used for removing common off of a Boomed survivor. Can also stumble specials infected.

Disadvantage: Specials are unaffected as are some common.

Molotov

Advantage: Great for a quick barrier, a nice wall of fire to eliminate most common infected and place other specials on fire.

Disadvantage: It is just in a small spot and smarter infected go around. Takes time to reach full flame. Must hit ground to start fire.

Bile Jar

Advantage: Relocates zombies to another area/target; can blind specials; explodes on impact if it hits an infected.

Disadvantage: The zombies return to the survivors when its gone. It can cause zombies when there are naturally none. Explodes on impact even on survivors.

Each one has their own advantages and disadvantages as well as situational advantages and disadvantages which I won't elaborate on for fear that this post is already too long. You cannot make a game perfectly balanced, ever. 

For open areas: work with your team, strategize. This is something I see little of anymore when "good" players are on. They tend to think they are unstoppable and don't have to work with the team. When you get multiple people like this on the same team, its hilarious when all of you fail and the other team walks right into the saferoom. Sometimes, its better to not be that hunter and be the charger for that spitter. Being a "good" player is not just showing skill, its the ability to work with your team as well.

As for the points, well, I don't personally care.

Since I was involved I believe I have the right to post something here. 

This is how my mind went through that situation:

1. A tank was bought. 

2. We have only 4 survivors left, one being a stupid AI.

3. I see the tank in front of us and smack us back, I also noticed I we were all on a rooftop

4. I hit tab to see I'm a main.

5. One person just got boomed, maybe two.

6. I told my team I am going to run for it, as you hear in the game.

7. I jump down and hear a jockey hit my teammate somewhere behind me, and assuming the tank was right behind me, I didn't bother looking backwards to save some time.

I felt it was a reasonable rush. Given the dire situation, even though I didn't ask and did merely say "I'm just gunna run for it."

3 Survivors and a dumb AI bot vs 1 tank, 4 player infected, and 5 bot infected, and to top it all off, on a rooftop that the tank can smack us off of.

Even though none of us were down, none of the 3 of us could take care of that many special infected while dealing with common infected and a tank breathing down our necks, and on a small confined space like that rooftop.

Although I did not confirm it with my team, to which I am sorry for that, I took the liberty to push for some extra points. I have a button bound to buy adrenaline and I hit it after I said "I'm just gunna run for it."

I may have been recording that game, I am unsure but I will go check and if I was I will give the demo to Johnny and let him decide if I acted too quickly or not.

And plus Bambi, you do not rush simply to "return the favour" because the other team did. You rush for points when the situation is dire.

I need someone to take my 25s and then yell, "Clony, you and your bloody hunters." Hope you get better soon Maestro so you can fulfill this need.

Isn't this stuff just common knowledge?

Heh, that is really nifty. I wonder if you could record which infected does which damage and see what a majority of the the server likes to play as?

Maybe x number of times spawning as smoker, hunter, boomer, etc... and how many boomed, or how many succesful smokes or something?

I don't know, just nifty information to see.

Being able to change your character to any you want would mess with the "mains" right, unless the Left 4 Fix thing was ever implemented

Biggs, I was thinking something along those lines too, wondering if the server could have possible skin mods included but if the connected person doesn't have those, it reverts to the normal one, or if incompatible ones it reverts to normal. 

Not really a whitelist but more of the server having add-ons files other than maps?

What kind of mods are we talking about here?

Then watching scores 112 v 1500.  Come on.  Do you really enjoy games like that?

In all honesty Turbo, yes. When the game gets to the point where it becomes so easy to win, everyone literally starts messing around on one team and starts having a great time, nobody takes anything seriously and everyone on the winning team is enjoying themselves.

On the other hand the other team is miserable, just constantly asking for a scramble or just chanting to themselves over and over, "This isn't fair" or "This game is so stacked." 

I guarantee you though if you were to take this person that was chanting its so stacked or this isn't fair and slap him on the winning team where everyone was laughing and giggling and enjoying themselves, he would forget about his previous argument that the game was unfair and start chiming in with the other people having fun.

My point here is this: if you want to point out stacked teams and try and do something when the game is clearly going to be on-sided, that is totally fine. However, DO NOT sit there on the losing team and say the teams are stacked if you are not willing to say that on your own completely stacked team when you are winning. There are plenty of people on this server that do that and I have seen this scenario countless times. Edit2: This scenario is present with admins and members alike. A person on the losing team complains even if its the slightest disadvantage, yet when on the winning team even when completely stacked, does nothing because they are enjoying themselves.

I will not lie, I am guilty of this, as we all are or have been at one point. I'm not perfect and neither are you, and unless you are perfect, you don't have the right to ridicule me for this, albeit I'm sure some peoples opinions of me will drop no doubt, but I can't satisfy what everyone expects of me nor will I try to because its pointless to conform to what everyone else wants and drop what I want.

So unless you do this for both teams, call stacks whether or not you are on the winning or losing team, do not post in this thread, and let it die.

Edit: This is to encourage you to do as san's email says so that you can say, "I am one of those that helps both teams regardless of stacked teams."

You guys can expect some hunters to be flying around, cause guess what, Im in

Cant you do something Jackie where if the chat sees a "!" it takes all the stuff afterwards and then applies a tolower() function of some sort? This way only have a few commands rather than an extensive list?

I don't think this would really work, although its a nice idea.

Here is a little known fact. 

You can headshot any infected from any angle. Yes I mean any angle. That includes shooting a boomer through his gelatinous body and hitting his head. You can shoot a boomer in the nuts, but if the bullet exits the boomers body from the head, a headshot is attained.

How many of you have gotten a headshot on a boomer that was flying over your head, I mean directly over your head, that is an example right there.

Edit:

However, the reverse is not true, if you shoot the head first and it comes out the back, it does not remove your headshot. Basically, if it hits the head at all, entering or exiting, or just passing through one arm, hitting the head and then exiting the other arm, you get a headshot.

Edit 2:

My whole point of saying this is, you can't really tell if you only hit the head or if the bullet penetrated the body first, which would cause a full explosion.

I agree, can I be added

Incorrect Jerky

24 damage per punch = 1.2 or 1.4 points

24 damage rock throw = 1.2 or 1.4 points

Respectfully, I must refute you sir. Eight to ten seconds is still somewhat exaggerated.  You are assuming a majority of the team is actively shooting, but more importantly, hitting the tank consistently for all 8 seconds.  There are only a few areas where the tank is lined up perfectly and without any cover for this to happen.

I do not exaggerate, with tier 1 weapons in L4D1 you can kill a tank in 15 seconds. With tier 2 weapons even faster, closer to 10 seconds, why would the transition to the second game where the Tank has all the same properties as the first, change that fact. My statement about the Left 4 Dead 2 Tank in this server is not exaggerate, with the higher tier weapons and even more players shooting, logic states that it should die faster and it does, a good 5 - 7 seconds faster.

"i will devour you." 

 

Im still waiting for someone to point out the oddity in my post, then I will know you guys fully read it :3

 

creepy as hell. man...

 

how come you guys didnt notice it???

 

We have a winner

Tl;dr

So butthurt

Im still waiting for someone to point out the oddity in my post, then I will know you guys fully read it :3

I've been meaning to post this for some time now because it has really been getting on my nerves lately. People claim stacks in general, and on any team that General is on as well, but there is some times when there is no stack at all, just a good player who has been given a game changer.

I am talking about the Tank, but not just any tank, a Clever Tank.

Some people will say, Tanks aren't that great, and to a point, these people are right. Given that no buffs have been attributed to a tank other than the fact that he can heal for a certain amount of points, he is still proposes a tough challenge. With 6k health he easily trumps the other infected's ability to withstand a bullet shower and can deal the 2nd most damaging hit in the game. 

Plenty of you are like, "Get on with it Clony, tell us why we are here." Well I intend to but you need to know some things first.

The Tank sucks. He flat out sucks. On any server, he sucks. On this server, he sucks just a hint less than all the rest. Here is a nice piece of information for you on how bad the Tank sucks.

From my Left 4 Dead 1 days, and now all of you who are going "Here we go, story time..." bear with me, the Tank is the only real infected that posses a challenge, and even there, in the first game, he sucks. Ill let you know just how bad he sucks. A tank can be killed with tier 1 weapons, those include the pump shotgun, the chrome shotgun, the smg, the silenced smg, and the pistol or double pistol, from 4 survivors in less than 15 seconds flat. You heard me, 15 seconds. The Tank sucks.

"Okay we get it the tank sucks, what are you getting at here." Settle down now, here comes the interesting part. Plot twist: The Tank is actually the best.

"This is nonsense I am out of here." Sit your butt down we haven't started yet.

A Tank can manipulate objects to his advantage, albeit only certain objects, and many of these objects have the ability to instantaneously incapacitate a survivor. It also should be noted that this object that incapacitates a survivor is not stopped on that survivor and can proceed to incapacitate as many as it wants before it stops. I will devour you. This is why he is the best. The tank is the only infected who can indirectly cause an instantaneous incapacitation without being anywhere near or in the sight of the survivors. Sadly, all maps are not littered with objects that can instantaneously incapacitate survivors and this is why the Tank sucks.

"We are going in circles Clony." Just read on and quit griping.

On any level without these objects, a Tank is at a huge disadvantage. On any level with these objects, the tank is at a huge advantage.

On any level without these objects, a Clever Tank is in his natural environment. On any level with these objects, a Clever Tank should win hands down.

Here we are, the whole point of this topic right here: Calling stacks in a game where a team just got wiped by a tank, while the other team made it, is utterly wrong and you should be kicked for even saying such ludicrous words.

Allow me to explain.

A Tank can down all 10 survivors in one swing. The odds of that happening are not high because most people are spread out, but if I get that one lucky hit that just happens to hit all 10 survivors, the round is over in a matter of seconds, maybe 2-4 seconds, and our team now has a massive lead but only because of that lucky hit we had. The teams aren't stacked, we just had a good tank.

Given the fact from earlier, about the tank dying in 15 second from 4 tier 1 guns, we can conclude that with 10 guns, which is 2.5 times the amount of bullet spray, and tier 2 guns that most people will have shortly after the round starts, which is double the amount of damage, we can conclude that the tank can die in a good.... 3 seconds of spawning based on statistics. But we will give the benefit of the doubt that not all players are aimbotters and will miss a few shots, so a Tank can die in a good 8-10 seconds.

One team can kill this tank that was unlucky and didn't get that nice hit to down all survivors and move on while they also get very lucky and end the round in one hit due to luck. But now due to this, a good distance in score is created and now people begin to call stacks just because the other team got lucky.

Give a Tank to a bad player and he will get himself killed.

Give a Tank to a good player and he will do some good damage.

Give a Tank to a lucky player and he can wipe the team.

Give a Tank to a Clever player and he will wipe the team.

A Clever Tank utilizes the objects to not only hit survivors with but also to shield himself from incoming bullet fire and reduce overall damage, increasing his lifespan and giving him more time to hit more things at the survivors. A Clever Tank knows when to go in and fight and when to run away and hide. A Clever Tank can wipe the team with just his bare fists.

A Clever Tank doesn't need to be lucky. A Clever Tank is.... well you get the point.

Just because a Tank wipes the team and the other team makes it to the saferoom, doesn't mean that the game is stacked, it just means that the person behind the Tank was either lucky or Clever.

How do you compensate for one person being Clever? You can't, you have to deal with it. Swapping him to the other team doesn't guarantee he can pull off the same trick again and make the game fair again. Swapping good players to the other team is one way to counter this Clever Tank but just swapping all the good players except him to the other team so his Clever Tank can't pull of that tank again will make a stack. Once the Clever Tank is killed, are the players they swapped going to come back? Probably not and a reverse stack will have been created trying to prevent a "stack" or as I like to call it "A Clever Tank."

How do you compensate for luck? You can't, you have to deal with it. The odds of the same thing happening twice are not likely.

Short Version:

The Tank sucks.

The Tank rules.

Clever Tank is Clever.

Luck is Luck.

One Clever Player is not stack friendly.

Luck is not stack friendly.