Tonto

Pretty much this. No offense guys, because I know GC is good people, but I'll stick to Demon's Souls for now. At least fist pounding and soul crushing failure can be blamed on only my stupidity. I simply don't have the kind of time to dedicate to a MP game that this one seems to demand. Sorry it hear, but it's not just L4D2 but most older games can get a bit like this. You get a diehard group of players who are the ones who hang around and they know the game and maps like the back of their hand, while the regular playerbase has mostly moved on. 10vs10 used to be much easier a year ago and later, there used to be 10-15 full EST time servers with good ping to choose from with different mods and players. It's actually how I learned most of my SI skills as it would give you way more SI gametime to work with (and manual picking of SI type) and with 10 'casual' players, your impact if you messed up wasn't felt as much The one thing with this mod, while a fun mod it does magnify the teams diffrences. As not only does a good SI attack score damage as in pure L4D2, it also gives the SI a points boost. Which means more SI or earlier tank. So points can make things go downhill quickly on mistakes, or makes things even easier for a team on a roll (points for healing etc..). That's one thing that makes this particular server more competitive and less forgiving than L4D2 in general.

Techinically speaking, not quite. I used to interchange the two also. "II. Defining 'Noob' Contrary to the belief of many, a noob/n00b and a newbie/newb are not the same thing. Newbs are those who are new to some task* and are very beginner at it, possibly a little overconfident about it, but they are willing to learn and fix their errors to move out of that stage. Noobs, on the other hand, know little and have no will to learn any more. ... "

Yes Tonto I agree its not cool to call people names, I have once in a while lost it to the point I'm like really guys and go off a little bit about the lack of team support. My whole thing is yes there are people who get pulled back or stuck or chain smoked(please i've been on this a few times so I understand that) its more like when people don't cover, don't make an effort and then freak out about someone trying to help or make suggestions. As far as the non-English there are a lot of people who aren't English speakers but you have people like Dean for example who doesn't know english really well but he is always communicate with the team even with something as simple as smoked or charged in back. You don't have to be perfect at English but being able to communicate in some fashion is helpful, even if you just can type Help. I just want people to be open to learning or asking for help versus assuming because you are new we think you suck or don't want you on our team that is not the case at all. Its more like if you openly ask questions, ask how the buy menu works, ask questions to know better versus not saying a word ever or only to complain about the people who are trying to make suggestions and set up good attacks. Jackie & Valen put it best you are only as good as your worst/lest experienced player. This is truly a game where one person who takes no suggest who takes no advice who isn't willing to learn can bring a team of 9 other people down. And Valen on the infected, it is easy to pew pew and have someone be able to come back and save you time and time again and maybe bounce back from the lack of experience or attention but on infected, 4 people attacking 10 while the other 6 are doing there own thing and not wanting to take suggestions really you can make up for that, it is just to hard on infected to pick up the slack of people who aren't willing to learn or work as a team. Oh yeah, I understand, just mentioning a little unwinding in general might help the team atmosphere, and that's for people raging without a real reason unlike your examples. And certainly if someone is freaking out just because they are getting helpful suggestions pointed at them, that's just as bad as negativity. I've gone with the team on leaving people who just won't respond. And on the inf side, yep I'm usually calling for support/teamwork in the back when we've snagged a couple (and sighing when it doesn't come). As I mentioned, my comments were not aimed at you, more to some of the other rage I've seen. Just an example I've been hit with personally on the verbal stuff. Teams down on points so I guess stress is going up. While our group is running into a building someone in the middle shuts the door (god knows why) and three of us basically smack face first into it just as the spits hits. So you're stunned for a sec because you didn't expect the door to be shut, you try and get out of the spit, but basically with the combination of both you go down. Then you get the yells on the mic 'why are you noobs in the spit, you're just feeding points....'. Situation is bad enough without the incriminations... and trying to say what happened while the same guy is still raging on the mic while also trying to have the team works things out.... doesn't work. I guess you can call this my personal rant, the needless negativity. For the English, I was thinking more of they won't be getting the detailed ambush plans, more so than not typing 'help', 'smoker' etc. But yeah, who knows if it's lack of English or folks trying to squeeze in one more SI spawn before setting up and waiting at the choke point. Everyone does it, there's been more than a few times where I have see the person calling for the ambush setup, themselves not setup at the ambush point Edit- Wow, all posting within a min and a quad post from Chick hehe

From the other side of things, might help to not throw insults around because you're losing. Not specifically you Chick, but there's some 'leaders' out there who will start the 'oh you guys suck', 'we have a team of noobs' comments just because an ambush wasn't done at a certain point. Remember that not everyone has played No Mercy 100 times before (seems a server fav) and knows the exact setup for each point. Also when you find one at the back, it's not always because they don't know what they are doing and are hanging back. With the regulars it could also be a chain smoke setup or a good jockey, once at the back, always ganked. Lots of vocal negativity shuts up the whole team and kills anyone even trying to help. More time is spent on the mics with acusations fying across than teamwork being done. Much different from someone who doesn't know the !heal command etc. Also, later at night it is, more chance of none English speakers. Something you can't avoid unless you want to put an English test question they have to answer before logging in.

Might be nice to see people buying Adrenaline (in emergencies) to get teamates up instead of just relying on SP and !heal. 3 Adrenaline for one !Heal when before it was almost one to one. More L4D player action instead of SP....?

Hey, just wanted to say I've popped back in and had some really good games lately, with people moving around and just some good old close matches that didn't require any. Thanks

Jocky jump would be nice as jockey is underpowered in points servers imo. The fact with points and server rules the survivors stick much more together, the jockey has few separation or damage abilities (no fast hit and travel distance like charger, no damage like hunter, no stealth like smoker). At least the jump will give it a few more options in regards to incap with ledges or at least getting someone past a barrier which requires a longer run back.

I've got to ask, and it's hard without sounding like an donkey but on the other side of Valens question.. "Before I begin, Team Stacking as in 5v8 not "Lol all the admins/members/best players are on the same side". What is with the admins/members being always on the same side? I've tried the server a number of times and even with scores of 3500-500 teams stay set. I assume admins/members are immune to scrambles as the one time I saw one I think two people moved, no one with the icons over their head (I assume those are members)did. I've seen it lead to a new map starting with 10vs3 as you would expect 7 people RQ one side, and yes no one moved over to make it even. Is that somehow not an issue when 5VS8 is one just because it's pubbies? I know it's your/their server and friends like playing with each other, if that's the general policy of the server, fine I understand and can move on no problem. A shame as love the plugin and good ping. But fyi, it does get the rep of being the first regular 10vs10 pub stomp server, as it comes up as a point in Valens post that has to be excluded first before talking about stacking. If it wasn't happening, he wouldn't have had to clarify. On the 10VS10 server btw, not the Vicious inf. Anyway just wondering what the thoughts were, Thanks.