LongHair April 3, 2003 Share LongHair Member April 3, 2003 Hey everyone! Hope all is well with thy computer hardware... mine ain't performing as well as I'd like... my poor HP Pavilion P3 650 MHz Piece of crap just doesn't quite meet my computing needs anymore.... Having watched Mag build his (or I should say Gunny and his pal) I'm turning to you guys for suggestions of what I should get. Basically I want a machine that I won't have to replace for a LONG time that will satisfy all my gaming needs... I don't need a monitor or any of the peripherals... simply the case and the inner workings therein... mobo, powersupply, Processor, HD, CD-RW, Graphics card, etc. etc. Looking to keep the price under $1000, and I hope to build in June at the latest. Thanks in advance for all the help! Here's what I had in mind as far as specs: Mobo: no idea here... mag and Chief have given me a little insight into what I want, but I have no real experience with this Power supply/case: again not alot of experience here, but I don't really care about looks, so long as its big and roomy. (my current "tower" is impossibly too small, and I can't fit cards into the slots with out being worried about frying wires) Graphics Card: ATI or Nvidia... ah the question continues... I'm leaning towards a nice GeForce4 Processor: Again kinda clueless... thinking a P4 somewhere above 2.4 GHz... perhaps the highest they got out, if its not too expensive. Is there a significant defference between the P4 and the Athlon? Hard drive 80 Gigs I guess is the goin norm... any particular brand better than another? CD drives definitely want a burner... DVD Player optional, if I can get everything else I want and still stay below budget then w00t! OS: I guess i'm stuck with buying a copy of Windows XP. SoundCard I'm all ready planning on getting a high end SoundBlaster Audigy or Audigy 2 card, perhaps the platnum... for audio capture and recording. (must try to fulfil my dreams of actually recording a decent tune, my 4 track just don't cut it no more) Again thnx for all the help Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest TeKNiK April 3, 2003 Share Guest TeKNiK Guests April 3, 2003 I'll put my imput on a couple subjects here. Processor - I am an AMD fan but the P4's are faster right now in speed. Your choice on that one. I have been told AMD is the way to go for Gaming but overall speed the P4's are much faster with the fastest P4 out right now being the 3.08 or 3.06 GHz? (Correct me if I am wrong) I recently just picked up a 120 gig Hard drive from Circuit City for 80 bucks (After rebates of course). Used strictly for storage space. I have 2 40 gigs in there as well so that brings my total storage space up to 200 gigs. I sugest Western Digital as they are very well known as a great brand of HDD. Video Card - I am still going to have to go with NVidia on this one regardless of how well ATI's outperform them. Picking up a GF4 right now is a great time as they are very low in price and perform fairly well. OS. Use Microsoft XP Pro. I am sure one of your friends has it lying around on cd somewhere. Power Supply - Brand I dunno but if your planning on running a fast processor I say go for a fairly big power supply. I got a 500 watt in mine now. May I also sugest an Audigy Sound card. Terrific sound card IMO. But if your goign for editing then for for the Audigy 2. I have an ATX Gaming case now. Case looks exactly like the AlienWare cases. I put a blue Cathode light in to light it up. Got it for 80 bucks. My 2 cents on this subject. Its all just going for what you can afford and are comfortable with. GL when you decide to build it. Let us know what you decide to get and how it goes. L8r Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gunman April 3, 2003 Share Gunman Member April 3, 2003 Mobo: ASUS P4PS8X....533 fsb...very nice...also pretty cheap in price! Dropped again last week. Gunny Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest RedMagic April 3, 2003 Share Guest RedMagic Guests April 3, 2003 Gunman y u keep saying P4pS8x isnt it just P4S8X because that is wat my mobo says btw my computer meets ur standards and i spent less then 700$... Mobo:Asus P4S8X Cpu:Pent 4 2.4ghz 533fsb Ram:1gig PC2700 ddr333 HDD:Western Digital 8mb Cache 80gb Video:Radeon 9500 128ddr(Geforce is cheaper) Sound:integrated for now upgrading soon Case:some styling gaming case with pw supply for 47$ 350Watts 3 fan slots(not to big and roomy though) Think bout it only spent around 650 but there i did not have to buy XP had it laying around Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrX April 3, 2003 Share mrX GC Alumni April 3, 2003 AMD has caught up in speed. At least, so says this article. And still cheaper. I've not had a single problem with the AMD 1.4 chip I got a year or more ago. Even on a lower end board like the ECS K7S5A, it performs very well. Audigy cards are simply the way to go IMO. Nvidia video card. Western Digital hard drive. 350 watt PSU min. Those are my prefs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chief April 3, 2003 Share Chief Member April 3, 2003 With price limitations, I'm going to put in the pitch for throwing down on the AMD bandwagon. The savings kind of snowball as you go through the mobo, the processor, then the memory. Keep in mind that you can save major cash now by buying a midrange processor and upgrade to the top end of your mobo later when prices are down significantly. Radeons outperform but every site you go to is talking about it having a glitch with this game or that driver. GeForce : GT40 :: Radeon : Ferrari {1960s} If you shop around you can get lots of great integrated stuff on you mobo and not have to buy other things. My asus a7n8x deluxe already has digital audio, dolby even. Saved big bucks there. and I have dual LAN, onboard RAID, serial ATA, plenty of USB/USB 2.0 slots. I saw great reviews on asus cd/cdrw drives and they are fast and quiet as I was lead to expect. I skipped the DVD because I have thousands of dollars in hometheater and the DVD software promise just ain't happenin' anytime soon. And you can add it later when DVD +/- RW drives are reasonable. Don't cut corners on memory. Get the cl2 not 2.5 and go for the premium stuff. And buy lots of fans, they're cheap and protect your investment. caveat emptor: I had little idea what I was doing on this machine and am only more dangerous now that I know a little bit more. Chief oh yeah, Newegg has XP Pro/ SP 1 for less than 150 IIIIFFFF you buy it when you buy hardware. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
[Mmmm]Homer April 3, 2003 Share [Mmmm]Homer Member April 3, 2003 Mobo: I read the reviews at Tom's Hardware and put alot of weight behind their reviews. There are other places out there, Anandtech comes to mind, which I like to check for a second opinion. When buying an AMD mobo I always go to AMDmobo and check their excellent forums to find any issues or compatibility issues. I haven't found a really great Intel forum that is similar. Intel and AMD, it's really your choice. AMD tends to be cheaper because the mobo, cpu, and RAM as a combined package end up being cheaper. It's really based on if what you can afford. If you go AMD get the nForce2 chipset for sure. Power supply/case: I've had way too many 'issues' with generic PSU's & underpowered PSU's to buy anything but a 400+ watt quality PSU. Check around for prices and ratings, but I generally go with Enermax. As far as a case, I have a large Chieftec case. Antec and Enermax buy this case (usually in black) and stick their own PSU in it and call it their brand. I like big for several reasons: lots of hard drives, better cooling, no CD-ROM can only go in top slot or it will hit mobo issues, and with more air volume in it you can run fans at slower speeds. I like adjustable speed fans. I'd really like to get a nice Lian-Li, but I'm afraid of scratching it and they are expensive. Graphics Card: I have a GF4/Ti4600 (had nVidia cards for about 3 years now) and if I was buying I'd get a Radeon 9700, or the next gen ATi out when you purchase, barring some huge surprise by nVidia. The reason is DX9 compatibility, you said you want this for the long haul, which means stepping up and getting the latest so you won't be left behind in a year. Processor: Intel: 533mhz bus, as fast as you can affort. The 3.06ghz HT hyper-threading chip is expensive and not really required, if you go Intel get what you can afford. AMD: Get a 333mhz bus chip, they are the latest on the AMD side. Especially if you go AMD I would get a very good quality heat sink. Copper is good, and bigger is better. Better heatsink = less fan required = quieter. RAM: Get 512mb in 1 stick min, or 2 512mb sticks if you can afford it. Get a decently rated RAM (look in newegg customer ratings). Hard drive: I use Western Digital Special Edition 8mb cache drives myself, they are about the only drives left with a 3 year warranty and they are super performers. I personally like RAID 0 and have a pair of 80gb's, and a couple of Maxtors as backup. I've had problems with Maxtors lately so I don't trust them 100% and I was a fan of IBM drives until their drives were dropping like flies recently. CD drives: I've had DVD drives and never watched a DVD on my PC. A decent CD-RW is all I use. About all of them have a Burn-Proof/Smart-Burn type technology nowadays. I like Lite-On as a quality cheaper brand. Check what software the drive comes with, it can sway your decision. OS: Home or Pro, doesn't really matter. I put the latest version of Norton SystemWorks on every PC I build as an all around antivirus/diagnostic tool. Get OEM versions of the OS and Norton for cheap, $90 Home, $135 Pro, and $19 Norton SW Pro. (Note: It can be missed but Newegg has a Software tab at the top. Another good place to get software is www.directdeals.com ). SoundCard: The new nForce2 mobos have what I've heard is really good sound on mobo. If you need more for the recording side the Audigy 2 might cut it, there are semi-expensive professional sound cards out there too. Other items: You could get a KVM (keyboard/video/mouse) switch if you want to retain your old PC for backup/mp3 server/etc. If you have broadband and don't already have a gateway router I highly recommend the Linksys series of routers. I have the BEFRS41. Firewall, hub, and router with easy setup. If you want a cool looking system there are alot of affordable case mods out these days. Many colors to choose from, and a black case is easier than ever to build. I use a removable hard drive tray for doing my backups. With GB's of info I have neither the time nor patience for burning 20 CD-ROMs to backup or buying a DVD burner that will take 5 DVDs. An extra hard drive is a fast easy way to do all your backing up. I check Pricewatch.com for a general sense of everything then I...... ORDER FROM NEWEGG. If you haven't used them you will be very impressed. Great service, great web site, fast shipping, and bulletproof return policy. When looking at an item there click on the Read Reviews link to get customer's opinions, a good backup to other reviews you will have read. Picture links to all items too. Sharky Extreme's Guides. Check out the latest High-end and value systems to get an idea of the latest and greatest, really good current info always here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chief April 3, 2003 Share Chief Member April 3, 2003 After following that same advice, reviews mostly and money secondly pushed me down the AMD, nforce chipset path. HAVE FUN! Chief Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
[Mmmm]Homer April 3, 2003 Share [Mmmm]Homer Member April 3, 2003 After following that same advice, reviews mostly and money secondly pushed me down the AMD, nforce chipset path. Which is also a high-performance path. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gunman April 3, 2003 Share Gunman Member April 3, 2003 Gunman y u keep saying P4pS8x isnt it just P4S8X because that is wat my mobo says btw my computer meets ur standards and i spent less then 700$... Mobo:Asus P4S8X Cpu:Pent 4 2.4ghz 533fsb Ram:1gig PC2700 ddr333 HDD:Western Digital 8mb Cache 80gb Video:Radeon 9500 128ddr(Geforce is cheaper) Sound:integrated for now upgrading soon Case:some styling gaming case with pw supply for 47$ 350Watts 3 fan slots(not to big and roomy though) Think bout it only spent around 650 but there i did not have to buy XP had it laying around Take away the Radeon and toss in a G4 Ti4200 128MB you got yourself my exact machine. Which I ended up spending about $650 on. Nice machine Red, oh yeah it is P4S8X, Gunny *EDIT* The $650 includes my monitor and Windows XP. I really hunted for the best price. */EDIT* Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bullet-401 April 3, 2003 Share bullet-401 Member April 3, 2003 GO ATHLON!!!!!!!!! Better clock speeds for gaming. You can get a lesser speed for athlon and it will out perform a higher p4. Oh yeah i almost forgot. Alienware came out with a new case. Too bad you cant just buy the case. Case Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest RedMagic April 3, 2003 Share Guest RedMagic Guests April 3, 2003 not my favorite case!!! but i guess it looks ok.and gunny where did u find all that for 650? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NOFX April 4, 2003 Share NOFX Member April 4, 2003 http://www.antarespro.com/plist.asp I've bought 2 systems for my friends from this place, pretty cheap prices when considering, they put it together for you and test it, and you dont have to pay the cost of shipping if you order your comp in pieces from 5 different places..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dwEEziL April 4, 2003 Share dwEEziL Member April 4, 2003 For the record, that case is made by Antec and repackaged/sold Enermax, Chieftec, Alienware, and a ton others (Googlegear even has a "house" case that is the Antec case. Second, make sure when you buy your mobo/memory what the best configuration is. Some mobos highly recommend you running paired memory. Also, like has been said, for gaming, cas2 is the way to go. Last I checked, Googlegear.com had a great deal on some 512MB cas2 Corsair XMS memory. Also, if you plan to ever do some overclocking, you might want to go with the DDR3500, that way, if you OC your fsb, you will also get some (albeit minimal) increase in your RAM performance as well. Like has been said, a power supply is key. Just getting a 450w one doesn't always do the trick cuz of the way the power is distributed across the rail. Often, the 5v and the 3.5v (is that the right numbers?) share the same rail. The next power supply I get will either by an Enermax (which still shares the 5v/3.5v rail) or the Antec TruPower (which has a dedicated rail per each). Vid card...I myself am going to move away from the nVidia and get an ATI Radeon AIW 9700 Pro in the very near future. Since this is the last vid card I get for a couple of years, I wanted the best (or rather, on generation back to save a little $$) so it will last. Sound...If it is a key issue to you, get the Audigy2...you can't go wrong. If not, just use onboard. I have been using onboard sound for the past 6 months and it hasn't bothered me. Of course, I am also going to be getting an Audigy2 Platinum to go with my Radeon. Aren't tax returns great? Case...you can get more than adequate ones for very cheap. Some good quality ones and sharp looking to boot would be the Lian Li or Coolermaster cases. Being aluminum, they are more cooling-efficient. And if you want space, the Lian Li 700 series (the server series) has more space than you can ever want. Hard drive...I would go with one of the Western Digital 8MB cache ones. I saw a great deal on a 200GB one a week ago on techbargains.com . Would have got it but didn't have the room on the CC. You might want to opt for one bigger than 80. If you are going to sound mixing/recording, for good quality, that will take up a lot of space. Hmm, I think that is all I have to say. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LongHair April 4, 2003 Author Share LongHair Member April 4, 2003 *EDIT* I realize the next line sounds a little sarcastic... it isn't. Thank you all for all your help so far ---> */EDIT* WOW thanks Fellas! big help... So far all of you have managed to sway my decision from p4 to athlon to p4 to athlon... I dunno! ANyway, just cruising around on Newegg.... here are two possibilities. Opinions please: Computer #1: +ASUS P4S8X Motherboard for Intel P4 478 +Intel Pentium 4 / 2.53GHz Northwood 512K Socket 478 Processor 533MHz Processor Bus +CRUCIAL MICRON 512MB 64x64 PC 2700 DDR RAM - OEM (x2) Computer #2: +Asus Motherboard for AMD Athlon/XP/Duron Processors, Model# A7N8X Deluxe Retail +AMD ATHLON XP 2500 "Barton" 333 FSB PROCESSOR CPU- RETAIL +CORSAIR MEMORY XMS Extreme Memory Speed Series CMX512-2700C2 PC2700 DDR RAM 333MHz w/ Heat Spreader - OEM (x1) Here's what will be in both machines: +BLACK CHIEFTEC Server Chasis Workstation Tower with Plastic Front Cover +Plextor DVD/CDRW IDE Combo Drive +SONY 1.44MB 3.5 INCH INTERNAL FDD DRIVE - OEM-BLACK +WD WESTERN DIGITAL "SPECIAL EDITION" 80GB 7200RPM EIDE HARD DRIVE MODEL # WD800JB - OEM, DRIVE ONLY +MSI Model G4Ti4200-TD8X, 8X AGP, 128MB DDR, TV-out, DVI - Retail -I'll be going with onboard sound for now... doesn't look like I can afford the platnum just yet... not to mention I really haven't written any music for quite sometime. Perhaps a Christmas present to myself.... TOTAL COSTS Computer #1: $874.99 Computer #2: $852.99 not included in cost: WindowsXP, Keyboard, mouse, BF1942, or C&C Generals. I all ready have a nice monitor. Differences and Queries... + #1 has a gig of RAM, but its cheaper Ram. The Athlon machine will have 512 but its the Corsair XMS 2.0 CAS, which I've heard has trouble when you put mre than one stick in, but the one stick performance is bad a$$. + THe Pentium (#1) will be running at 2.53 GHz where the Athlon Processor (#2) is only 1.83, (the Mobo does suppoort upto thw XP3000 Barton... so upgrade later is possible) Is this a big deal or will performance be about the same? My feelings: At this time I'm leaning towards the athlon... reading up on the mobo has a big smile on my face, but I'm worried about the processor, mainly b/c I don't know the difference (if any) between running a P4 at 2.53 or an Athlon at 1.83. Cost for the processors is about the same ($186 and $175 respectively). One last thing... <---- what the hell is this thing? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
[Mmmm]Homer April 4, 2003 Share [Mmmm]Homer Member April 4, 2003 For about the same price as the Plextor combo I would go with: Lite-On 52/24/52 here and a Lite-On 16x DVD here Pro's: You can copy CD's with 2 units If one breaks..... Both are black BF1942 requires CD to be in drive, install if from one of them and leave the disc in. Actually costs less than the combo drive. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
[Mmmm]Homer April 4, 2003 Share [Mmmm]Homer Member April 4, 2003 Also, the XP2500+ should be very comparable to the P4, but since AMDs are cheaper I usually 'cheat up' a little on so that If I was thinking about getting a 2.0ghz P4, then I will get an AMD XP2200+ instead of an XP2000+. The price point of the XP2600+ looks good right now, it's around the price of a 2.53ghz P4. Great article on Tom's hardware comparing 100mhz to 3.06ghz Intel and AMD chips Also: How Good Are AMD's Bundled Coolers For The Athlon XP ? on Tom's Here is what I use: SLK-800 although I would get one of these if I was getting a new one: SLK-900 p.s. You attach an 80mm fan to the of it, I have an adjustable one on it keeping my XP2000+ running at around 47 C idle, it bumps up only to 48.5 C under load. If I crank up the fan it will drop to 44 C idle and 48 C load, not worth the noise to me. My PC sits under the table on wood floors and it's very acceptable noise-wise with 4 80mm fans turning at moderate speeds + Enermax Whisper series PSU fans. If you achieve under 50 C (under load) and have a quiet-ish PC you can consider it a success. There are guys that get them down in the lower 30's C but go deaf from fan noise. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest TeKNiK April 4, 2003 Share Guest TeKNiK Guests April 4, 2003 Man, Homer is the king of computers I see. He knows whats up about everything. Great job man, keep up the good work. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
[Mmmm]Homer April 4, 2003 Share [Mmmm]Homer Member April 4, 2003 Just have built about 30 pc's over the last 6-7 years, you learn this stuff. Read a few web pages daily. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Magruter April 4, 2003 Share Magruter Member April 4, 2003 Homer, you had me at hello!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NOFX April 4, 2003 Share NOFX Member April 4, 2003 man, If your gonna spend 900 bucks go with the P4. Two reason for this I say: P4 = 2.4Ghz 2500+ = 1.83Ghz now the big thing is...... 2500+ runs on a 333Mhz Front Side Bus P4 runs on a 533Mhz Front Side Bus also if you get that P4 on the 533 bus, dont get PC2700 RAM, go with RDRAM. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NOFX April 4, 2003 Share NOFX Member April 4, 2003 wow that article reminds of the days when I was like 10 yrs old and my dad was teachin me how to build comps and he got me a 486SX I think it ran at 33Mhz maybe 66Mhz Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LongHair April 8, 2003 Author Share LongHair Member April 8, 2003 ah my wish list... http://secure.newegg.com/app/WishR.asp?ID=277546 I think I've done it. If you guys wouldn't mind checking it out. b4 I hit "buy"... I'm al ittle worried if the components are compatible or not.... pretty sure they are... Again, Thanks Everyone! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dwEEziL April 8, 2003 Share dwEEziL Member April 8, 2003 All parts looked good to me. Didn't see any incompatibilities. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
[Mmmm]Homer April 8, 2003 Share [Mmmm]Homer Member April 8, 2003 NOFX brought up the 333 vs 533 and 2.4 vs 1.83. Think of it as two car engines making 300hp each. One is a 350ci V8 and the other is a turbo 6 cylinder. Both make the same power but in different ways. For just a bit more money I'd go with a Radeon 9500 Pro. You'll get better than Ti4200 performance and DX9 support. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Create an account or sign in to comment
You need to be a member in order to leave a comment
Create an account
Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!
Register a new accountSign in
Already have an account? Sign in here.
Sign In Now