Acronym's in game

[zero0]

I wish to address something that has been bothering me lately. This topic is regarding the use of acronyms in game usually in the form of text. Here is a copy of the server rules I have found in the forum:

 

Our rules (condensed):

- No swearing

- No porn sprays

- No racism, bigotry, or other disrespectful comments

- If you don't have nuthin nice to say, don't say nuthin at all

- Don't argue or debate with admins in game. Use our forums, please.

- All of the above goes for both voice and text comms in-game (or over Vent)

- No Hax. We have zero-tolerance for hacking, auto-aim, etc.

- Just because a game is "mature" does not give you leeway to break any of the above rules even if the game characters do or say "stuff"

 

I have had a few heated discussions with a couple of admins regarding acronyms in game. I haven't even been the one using them, but I have a problem w/ admins wanting to warn or kick players for their use. An acronym is "not" a curse word or base or coarse language. The use of them is used as a euphemism so that they are not using bad language in a game and to suggest in my humble opinion that is the equivalent of the actual word is just plain silly. If I wanted to have an outburst and go awe ffffff, but that is as far as I took it, that would not be coarse language. It is a euphemism, I could have been saying french fries, Friday, or Freddy etc, and to be honest I don't think anyone would be offended. Again I am someone who has rarely or ever used coarse language in game or in text, out of respect for the server, players, or community. However to suggest that the use of individual letters that do not form words is offensive is being a little silly. The rules expressly say no swearing and I truly respect that and appreciate it, but to suggest that letters that don't form words is the same as cursing is not being realistic. I would be much more offended by one player putting down another player to be much more offensive and yet that happens all of the time. If I say my wife and I are gonna shake the walls in our bedroom tonight, everyone knows what I mean, but I could just be hanging up pictures. I am just trying to be cute, without being vulgar and I don't "think" anyone would be offended by that statement. I am making a euphemism, not expressly saying anything base or coarse...... a sort of acronym. Any feedback on this subject would be appreciated. I believe the rules we have are appropriate, but to keep nit-picking and extending things out to such an extreme level can make it difficult to enjoy the game and we are all here to have a little fun and blow off some steam and a little suggestive humor can go a long way. Thanks

 

Zero.

Edited September 21, 2012 by zero0

[tonerrrr]

What the french, toast?

 

http://youtu.be/WEJJUGJZxpU

[Fist]

agree'd with this. i think its going overboard with the acronyms

and plus i always get warned when i say "wtfudge"

[JackieChan]

"w-t-f" is most commonly known as "what the f***".

 

Ask 10 people this. All 10 replies will be the same.

[zero0]

With all do respect Jackie and I do respect your opinion and I am not trying to be a jerk to you, but this is what you posted in another thread.

 

Every once in a while, you get that big a-hole (people who get banned) who wants to rob your store. What do you do? Do you just let them have their way with all your stuff, or do you put a stop to it? Heck yes I'm going with the latter. You'll get those Good Guy Greg members who decide, "Hey, I like this store, and the people who manage it. I'm going to help the guy out and not have this place get robbed", or you might get those Scumbag Steve members who instigate and make matters worse. Kind of a weird example...

 

The term you used was an acronym of sorts. Everyone knows what you meant, but you actually didn't say the word. I was not offended by this and if you ask 10 people they probably knew what you meant and woud not be offended either. You were trying to put a strong point in your post withoug being vulgar. Everyone knows what you meant, without you having to use that word. You felt strongly about what you said and were trying to make a point. So when something crazy or frustrating happens in a game and someone throws letters out there there just trying to show how strong they felt about something without using the actual words. Just sayin'..............

[JackieChan]

A** and F*** are two completely different swear words when it comes to severity... Why do you think the Survivors say "A**" all the time in game, but NEVER say "F***"?

[Biggs]

Coarse language is a tough subject to handle, especially for l4d2... and this is certainly not a new conversation, whether we're talking about acronyms or otherwise. It really should be taken case by case, as oftentimes certain words are more or less severe in different contexts. In general, if an admin warns someone--just don't do it again. I'm not sure why this has to be any more complicated than that.

[zero0]

I totally agree with what you just said Jackie. My only point is the rules saying "no swearing" and I totally agree w/ that policy and think it is a good one, but letters that do not form words are in fact not words. We know that certain individual letters may represent a euphemism for certain words that are coarse and thats why someone would use them so as not to be overtly offensive. Such as using the term A-hole. I just think its a little silly to hold individual letters in contempt. Thats why one would use them instead of the offensive language. I realize the "F" word is considered to be more offensive than the "A" word, but if I was in a game and just got killed and I said "aawww F, I got killed"(the letter not the word) or if I said "thats trucked up" would that be considered offensive language........probably not. In the second example I didn't even use a word that started with the same letter as the word, but people would know what I was getting at. I can understand if someone gets a warning or kick if they are directing at someone in a hateful manner. That would certainly fall under the rule of not being disrespectful to others. I have also looked in a whole bunch of threads and found similar euphemisms to the ones we are discussing right now and no one is getting upset about it or saying how offended they are about those acronyms or euphemisms. So why do we give so much attention to an acronym with no context. All I am trying to say is that you and I in this thread have used the terms A** and F*** to have a converstation about this topic. Everyone knows what we mean, but we are not saying the word and I would harbor a guess no one was probably offended. We are merely having a polite conversation. In game that sometimes happens as well, and by using an acronym or letter to voice a strong emotion or for a little tongue in cheek humor as opposed to being truly offensive.

Edited September 21, 2012 by zero0

[Bunny]

Zero0, you make a valid argument. In fact, I see stuff like this all the time in Disney movies. We're talking movies for ALL AUDIENCES. If anyone's ever watched any animated movies, chances are...you've come across two characters talking, and one of them saying something like "shut the f..." and being interrupted by another character. I want to say that it's happened in Shrek, but I'm not entirely sure.

 

Words have no meaning in themselves, which is important to understand. People shouldn't be kicked/banned for saying "f" in "f u," they should be kicked/banned for being disrespectful. You shouldn't be kicked/banned for saying "f" because f is just a letter. If someone associates "f" as "truck," then they got a dirty mind and that is entirely their problem. But if you say "truck," then clearly...it's against the rules of the server, and is entirely appropriate to kick that member. Otherwise, it makes absolutely no sense to kick/ban the person. Just throwin' my two cents out there.

[Socks]

- If you don't have nuthin nice to say, don't say nuthin at all

 

In my opinion, this clause alone should make players hesitant to use swear words.

 

And yes, I understand swear words can be used lightly and jokingly, but this is L4D. This is not the community where free speech should be allowed. So, rather then wasting our time and effort on unreasonable demands we should focus our attention to more obtainable goals, such as increasing jockey spawns to 11. Come on, admins. What are you afraid of. Give us 11 jockeys!

 

Edit:

 

More on the point, acronym thing is just a loophole.

Edited September 21, 2012 by Socks

[chick82]

Just to point out Shrek is not a Disney movie. It's a Dreamworks. Disney doesn't have movies w/ swearing (at least none that I have seen and I've seen a lot) (this Part was suppose to reference a comment bunny made and not to be rude or say your wrong, just reminded me Of when I thought that it was disney)

 

 

Anyway WE are not 5, we are not stupid. WE all know what 85% of the world knows W.T.F. and F.M.L and FUUUUUUUUUU stand for.

 

Best example I had a teach if you did something and were like oh Fudge he would say no no no, and give you a little talking too, but if you said I like fudge on my ice cream.

 

 

Stop acting like a warning goes on your permit record and acting like a bunch of kids who just got yelled at for being rowdy when the teacher left the room. Just don't use it, and if you do use it and get warned, okay note to yourself Don't do it again.

 

I'm sick of these threads and arguments. And booohooo I can't get away with W.T.F. and F.M.L. and fuuuuu oh I'm going to make a thread and say getting warned is so over the top because as we all know a warning is so permit and so much ruins your fun. Just accept it as an okay this admin didn't see it as you trying to be abusive or breaking the rules but wants to let you know hey please don't say it again.

Edited September 21, 2012 by chick82

[ValenAlvern]

People shouldn't be kicked/banned for saying "f" in "f u," they should be kicked/banned for being disrespectful. You shouldn't be kicked/banned for saying "f" because f is just a letter. If someone associates "f" as "truck," then they got a dirty mind and that is entirely their problem.

 

F.U doesnt stand for Fun University.

 

If the contexts doesnt match with what others are saying/happening around you, then we ALL know what it means. If you dont got time to type them up, dont use acronyms that are commonly associated with bad words, you can say Forget You, but if you use the acronym version people WILL think the most common words because there is no context and its your fault that actually happened.

[Bunny]

Just to point out Shrek is not a Disney movie. It's a Dreamworks. Disney doesn't have movies w/ swearing (at least none that I have seen and I've seen a lot)

 

Not many animated movies do have swearing because they're most likely suitable for all audiences, is that point that I'm trying to make. It doesn't matter if it's Disney, Dreamworks, or whatever.

 

Anyway WE are not 5, we are not stupid. WE all know what 85% of the world knows W.T.F. and F.M.L and FUUUUUUUUUU stand for.

 

I didn't say...anyone was stupid? Just because I'm challenging a viewpoint doesn't automatically mean that I'm trying to talk down to you. C'mon...being respectful comes from both sides of the argument. I like to debate in forums because I find debates pretty fun...even if I could care less about it. I don't curse on L4D or anything, and that's precisely the point...we aren't 5 year olds. If we can't handle acronyms on a mature video game, then what CAN we handle in our lives?

 

Best example I had a teach if you did something and were like oh Fudge he would say no no no, and give you a little talking too, but if you said I like fudge on my ice cream.

 

There's also teachers who have sexual relationships with students. Just because one of your teaches has done it, doesn't make it right. C'mon now.

 

 

Stop acting like a warning goes on your permit record and acting like a bunch of kids who just got yelled at for being rowdy when the teacher left the room. Just don't use it, and if you do use it and get warned, okay note to yourself Don't do it again.

 

I don't get warned because I don't use it. But just because I don't own a gun doesn't mean I don't think people should have the right to own guns. Just because I challenge something or agree with something someone else says doesn't mean I'm acting like a kid. In your life, there's going to be people who disagree with your viewpoints or rules. That's kind of how America was founded...

 

I'm sick of these threads and arguments. And booohooo I can't get away with W.T.F. and F.M.L. and fuuuuu oh I'm going to make a thread and say getting warned is so over the top because as we all know a warning is so permit and so much ruins your fun. Just accept it as an okay this admin didn't see it as you trying to be abusive or breaking the rules but wants to let you know hey please don't say it again.

 

You are entitled to your opinion. We have free speech, do we not? It's not like I'm a telemarketer calling your house every 30 minutes and saying "hey! guess what! I hate the color of your house! Here's what you need to change..." I mean...it's a forum. You have no obligation to read the thread, or reply. It can't make you THAT sick if you put all the time and effort into making a response. I've read things I've disagreed with and thought it was a completely stupid argument...like "can you love two people at once?" Instead of lashing out on the members of the forum, I chose to take it out on Minesweeper. In the end, Minesweeper tinkled me off even more and I decided to read a book. C'mon...no one here is stupid. We can have a disagreement and still be able to see other sides of the story...

[Bunny]

People shouldn't be kicked/banned for saying "f" in "f u," they should be kicked/banned for being disrespectful. You shouldn't be kicked/banned for saying "f" because f is just a letter. If someone associates "f" as "truck," then they got a dirty mind and that is entirely their problem.

 

F.U doesnt stand for Fun University.

 

If the contexts doesnt match with what others are saying/happening around you, then we ALL know what it means. If you dont got time to type them up, dont use acronyms that are commonly associated with bad words, you can say Forget You, but if you use the acronym version people WILL think the most common words because there is no context and its your fault that actually happened.

 

For the record, I mentioned that you shouldn't say FU because it's disrespectful. Ultimately, I'm saying that you should never say FU during the game. I'm also saying that because it's disrespectful, it's something that many people can interpret. So I'm not disagreeing with you. But then there's the other possibility of combinations of words that could be debatable...so...

 

Edit:

 

On that note, I just wanted to throw my two cents...not have people get tinkled off from an opinion. I'll just slowly back away and say...it's a fun and games. No one means any harm, just wanted to share my opinion. That's all.

Edited September 21, 2012 by Bunny

[ValenAlvern]

People shouldn't be kicked/banned for saying "f" in "f u," they should be kicked/banned for being disrespectful. You shouldn't be kicked/banned for saying "f" because f is just a letter. If someone associates "f" as "truck," then they got a dirty mind and that is entirely their problem.

 

F.U doesnt stand for Fun University.

 

If the contexts doesnt match with what others are saying/happening around you, then we ALL know what it means. If you dont got time to type them up, dont use acronyms that are commonly associated with bad words, you can say Forget You, but if you use the acronym version people WILL think the most common words because there is no context and its your fault that actually happened.

 

For the record, I mentioned that you shouldn't say FU because it's disrespectful. Ultimately, I'm saying that you should never say FU during the game. I'm also saying that because it's disrespectful, it's something that many people can interpret. So I'm not disagreeing with you. But then there's the other possibility of combinations of words that could be debatable...so...

 

Edit:

 

On that note, I just wanted to throw my two cents...not have people get tinkled off from an opinion. I'll just slowly back away and say...it's a fun and games. No one means any harm, just wanted to share my opinion. That's all.

 

I was just adding to your statement, sorry if it sounded like I was attacking you or something cause I quoted you hehe.

 

EDIT:

 

I use to be the same when someone took my quote or something, unless they specifically say you or something, they're not attacking you...at least thats what I want to think.

 

 

EDIT 2:

 

Gaah, too many 'or something'

Edited September 21, 2012 by ValenAlvern

[chick82]

Whoa! Whoa! Whoa! I thought I deleted everything but the Disney line and shrek. I wasn't trying to insult you bunny at all or question anything you said.

 

Idk why it didn't delete the rest of your conversation but im sorry it was directed at you.

 

It was ment for everyone crying over warning on acronyms. It needs to stop and people need to stop getting made and try to debate it being something else. That's it

[zero0]

- If you don't have nuthin nice to say, don't say nuthin at all

 

In my opinion, this clause alone should make players hesitant to use swear words.

 

And yes, I understand swear words can be used lightly and jokingly, but this is L4D. This is not the community where free speech should be allowed. So, rather then wasting our time and effort on unreasonable demands we should focus our attention to more obtainable goals, such as increasing jockey spawns to 11. Come on, admins. What are you afraid of. Give us 11 jockeys!

 

Edit:

 

More on the point, acronym thing is just a loophole.

 

Socks, the clause applies to swearing. A letter is not swearing nor it is a loophole. It is an expression used that represents a word that is poor taste, but NOT used. A letter is not a word, it is a letter, it may represent many things including swear words, but it is not in fact a swear word, this is my whole point.

[JackieChan]

A letter is not a swear word...I think we can all agree on that, but the meaning behind the letter in the way it's used can be. "w.t.f" doesn't commonly stand for "Warm Toast Fun" , it commonly stands for "What The F***". Probably like 7 years ago, I got forum warned for using "w.t.f". Those were in my naive High School days though...and I got warned a lot, but even then I never questioned the not using of swear words on the forums/servers. I just went a long with it and the more I played at GC, the less and less I saw myself swearing and the need to swear. I don't do it NEARLY as much as I did before I made my account on GC...I see myself as a better person for reducing my need to swear than feeling the need to.

[zero0]

Just to point out Shrek is not a Disney movie. It's a Dreamworks. Disney doesn't have movies w/ swearing (at least none that I have seen and I've seen a lot) (this Part was suppose to reference a comment bunny made and not to be rude or say your wrong, just reminded me Of when I thought that it was disney)

 

 

Anyway WE are not 5, we are not stupid. WE all know what 85% of the world knows W.T.F. and F.M.L and FUUUUUUUUUU stand for.

 

Best example I had a teach if you did something and were like oh Fudge he would say no no no, and give you a little talking too, but if you said I like fudge on my ice cream.

 

 

Stop acting like a warning goes on your permit record and acting like a bunch of kids who just got yelled at for being rowdy when the teacher left the room. Just don't use it, and if you do use it and get warned, okay note to yourself Don't do it again.

 

I'm sick of these threads and arguments. And booohooo I can't get away with W.T.F. and F.M.L. and fuuuuu oh I'm going to make a thread and say getting warned is so over the top because as we all know a warning is so permit and so much ruins your fun. Just accept it as an okay this admin didn't see it as you trying to be abusive or breaking the rules but wants to let you know hey please don't say it again.

 

Hey Chick - You just used 3 acronyms (some of them twice) in your post and no one banned you, kicked you, or even acknowledged that you used them........why.......cause you didn't type a single offensive word. You used an inference represented by letters, to make your point. If I where to say dag nabbit, most people would realize that I really want to say something else, but out of consideration for others who may be offended, I censor myself to a more appropriate term...................and that is what the acronyms are for.......so you use letters instead of swear words or words that are in poor taste. I don't believe that if someone does that in game, especially a competitive one, if someone spouts out a couple of letters, blowing off some steam or joking around a bit, its not swearing, you are merely make an inference to a word that is only implied not spoken or typed and shouldn't be held in the same contempt as if you did say those words, but I have noticed people are being treated a little harshly for a LETTER not a word. Example - the other day I was playing on the server, there were no admins in the game and new person game in and used the "F" word. I kindly said to him that we can't swear in the server and expecailly don't use any F-bombs. Now we all know what F-bomb stands for yet no one gave me a warning or a time out for saying "f-bomb". Why......cause I used a euphemism for another word without using the harsh language and it wasn't a problem and people are doing the EXACT same thing when they throw a letter out there intead of using harsh language. Now if you are using those acronyms in a hateful way toward another player to humilate etc. Thats a totally different discussion. Now you dealing w/ no racism, disrespect other players etc. rule which is also in the server rules and a totally different situation.

Edited September 21, 2012 by zero0

[JackieChan]

Chick is merely using those as examples on what NOT to use in a discussion on the forums about the subject at hand. Any other time I'd have to backhand her in the facewarn her..

[chick82]

Chick is merely using those as examples on what NOT to use in a discussion on the forums about the subject at hand. Any other time I'd have to backhand her in the facewarn her..

 

Exactly, minus the backhand part cause jackie knows I would own him in a slapping contest.

 

 

If you die in l4d2 and say W.T.F. in game clearly there is a meaning behind it, you can sit here until you are blue in the face and say OH i meant fudge, or french fries, or fruit, or face, it doesn't matter you know what you meant the world knew what you meant.

 

AND FOR THOSE OF YOU WHO WANT TO QUESTION MY STANDING ON THIS. JACKIE & TIRTUL will tell you I threw a BIG OLD FIT when they said we couldn't use W.T.F. anymore cause I was like why not really are you serious. BUT i realized the point as to why. END OF DISCUSSION!

 

ITS A WARNING! <----Definition (courtesy google):

• A statement or event that indicates a possible or impending danger, problem, or other unpleasant situation.
  
• Cautionary advice.
  

 

 

I have a headache, bunny is upset with me over my error on the deleting of his content post minus the shrek disney thing. I'm honestly over this.

[Biggs]

We have free speech, do we not?

Free speech? Yeah, say whatever you want--but this is a private community with rules. There's no guarantee you won't be banned for what you say.

 

Bottom line: Don't be a dick.

 

These acronyms are marginally less offensive than the whole phrases spelled out, but to simplify things for everyone--players and admins alike--we've made a clear ruling that they're not allowed. There should be less confusion this way.

[MPG1770]

In general, if an admin warns someone--just don't do it again. I'm not sure why this has to be any more complicated than that.

 

There are always going to be people who like to try and make complications, mountains and molehills spring to mind.

 

 

I totally agree with what you just said Jackie. My only point is the rules saying "no swearing" and I totally agree w/ that policy and think it is a good one, but letters that do not form words are in fact not words.

 

 

Bit of a paradox here. You totally agree, but fail to understand the representation of those letters. These acronyms etc have been in use in the English language for some years and therefore have become a terminology of phrase, resulting in the pedantic pedagogy in their own right, hence, they are in fact internationally accepted as words and have found their place in the annuls of modern day lexicons.

 

 

In fact, I see stuff like this all the time in Disney movies.

 

Talk about JOTBW and going off on several conjuctive idioms simultaneously here - no let's not.

 

 

I could continue to analyse the pedantics etc., going on in this thread, but rather than being seen as insulting to people, I will conclude with this: the dumbing down of language is in part due to a political regimen whose control of the mass media is to keep the underclasses ill-educated. The sad fact is that society has been so manipulated by mass media under the auspices and approval by governments that this so-called 'Freedom of Speech' is actually not worth the 'expletive' paper it's written on.

 

One further quick point I may add, you all contractually agree to abide by a code of conduct whether purchasing membership or not.

If you do not possess the maturity to express yourself without the use of an expletive, abbreviated, acronym, misspelling or some other derivation of form, then either DO NOT say anything or you are free to go somewhere else.

 

I am but a poor lowly admin doing my duty looking after your welfare. I don't really want to kick or ban anyone from having a good time, but what some of you fail to comprehend is that with so many new people coming here they learn by experience and this has a bigger effect upon the GC Server and Community than you care to realise.

Edited September 21, 2012 by MPG1770

[Jerkoff]

The problem with using acronym for a curse word is your way of avoiding responsibility for actually saying the curse. Instead of owing up and just say it (which can be avoided entirely), you put the word into the listener's head. We process the puzzle behind your acronym and then we realize the full word in our head, which in turn harms us more than you.

[Masgnoh]

I had this one very religious friend in college.... avid church goer, full faith who used to say all the time, "What the fudge?"

 

I really hated it because of the hypocrisy. Whenever someone says "What the fudge?" everyone else actually thinks/hears "What the f***?" and that is the point. Even if you say that you don't intend it, it doesn't matter. You did everything besides the deed itself which is if anything, toying with the rules. Acronyms, common really? People aren't stupid. If somebody says wth, NOBODY thinks Water Thunder Fire. it's widespread and renown for its meaning which is to say... you may as well have wrote the whole thing out.