auggybendoggy December 6, 2003 Share auggybendoggy Member December 6, 2003 I recently had 2 missionaries come to my door. We talked for bout an hour. I find that it seems they do have things to hide from people. To make myself clear let me explain. When they first came to the door they endorsed all the christian beliefs...Jesus is the son of God...There is only one God...Jesus died for our sins. The one god thing was a bit interesting as I shared with them my troubles of the multiple Gods (we will someday be gods of our own worlds) doctrine. They did not deny this and when asked directly whether there is more than one God they responded with "there is but one God for us". This made me believe they were hiding something. The first impression is that there is only one God (no gods before, no gods after). But when approched concerning polytheism they then embrace multiple gods exist. Now I made it clear they're not talking about cars, movies, counterstrike, computers. They are talking there are gods above our God and so on and so on. My response was that in Isaiah God says "there are no gods before me nor will there be any formed after" They asked me if I knew the context of the passage. I said I believe I do. So I exlplained it to them. Isreal was bowing and worshipping to wooden and stone idols. So God tells Isreal "why do you bow to them don't you know there are no other Gods. NONE BEFORE ME, NONE AFTER" (my rendition). They replied "exactly" I responded "WHAT?" they had no explanation of the verse nor its context. again I believe I'm right about this passage that God is telling isreal "IM IT! There aint nothing else out there baffoons!" also it would make no sense if the Idols are gods and god says there are no gods before or after me....then what are the idols if they are gods. obviously God was telling isreal that they were bowing to wood and stone and not a god. I get the sense that when your raised in certain religion it's extremely hard to even treat scripture with fair rational logic. Anyone got some experience with mormonism? Auggy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xterminator December 6, 2003 Share Xterminator Member December 6, 2003 <------ Roman Catholic I dont konw any mormon's but i've read some stuff about them. Some of the stuff they do is kinda weird, they say mormonism is what leads to the secret society of the Free masons. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CowboyFromHell`X December 8, 2003 Share CowboyFromHell`X Member December 8, 2003 I just yell "NO" really loud and slam the door when they come. Next time I'm going to pour my drink over my head and yell at them for spiting me when they come. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
auggybendoggy December 9, 2003 Author Share auggybendoggy Member December 9, 2003 dude "cause Jesus came to your door....you left him out on the streets" I think they need help. Not so much from small minute issues of doctrine but from the fact that they believe baptisim saves em or keeping the law makes them good. I don't buy half the smack. I don't think they're being real about the bible. They say they are but when you talk about Jesus' deity and the OT passages they just dismiss them. I don't care what religion your in if you can't face up to problems or at least say "yea we got problems" then ITS BUNK! Jesus clearly states there aint gonna be no marriage. But Joseph smith says "oh yes there is and not just that but with many wives too." WHAT A LOAD OF CRAP! Anyone in a sound mind can see this dude was just horny trying to get a bunch of chicks! Am I right? Of course I'm right. Auggy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Theo77 December 9, 2003 Share Theo77 Member December 9, 2003 Jesus clearly states there aint gonna be no marriage. And exactly where does the bible say this?! I think you meant that there is only supposed to be ONE marriage. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
White Knight December 9, 2003 Share White Knight Member December 9, 2003 (edited) Theo, in the Perl of Great Price, a Mormon addition to the Bible. Edited December 9, 2003 by White Knight Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Theo77 December 9, 2003 Share Theo77 Member December 9, 2003 well that's already one thing wrong wit em Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
auggybendoggy December 9, 2003 Author Share auggybendoggy Member December 9, 2003 theo, the pharisees ask jesus a question "a woman marries a man...he dies. Later she marries his brother..he dies...this happens 7 times. which of these men will she be married to. Jesus responds "you don't understand the scriptures. At the ressurection no one will be married nor given in marriage. you will be like angels" what does that mean? I take it to mean there aint no marriage in heaven. Any thoughts anyone Auggy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Theo77 December 12, 2003 Share Theo77 Member December 12, 2003 thanks for clearin that up auggy (not trying to be sarcastic, i was really confused) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CannibalisticH0b0 December 13, 2003 Share CannibalisticH0b0 Member December 13, 2003 I'm an atheist, but I have to say that Mormonism is one of the stupidest religions in existance. I've read about their beliefs, how their religion started out, even talked to Mormons, and I have to say, HOW STUPID ARE THEY???? I might not agree with Christians, Buddhists, Jews, Muslims, etc, but I understand where they're coming from. However, Mormons have always amazed me with their especially extreme ignorance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
auggybendoggy December 13, 2003 Author Share auggybendoggy Member December 13, 2003 Cannibal, Thats sort of where I'm coming from. I'm a christian but I feel that even if I wasn't I'd say "you ignorant fools" how can you just dismiss so many arguments. I asked these 2 missionaries what did Jesus teach the South American Indians that he forgot to teach the disciples. They have no answer. of course I press that Jesus gave the whole gospel to the disciples. So what more is there? No response. They are WHACK! Auggy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trouble .gc December 13, 2003 Share Trouble .gc Member December 13, 2003 i have a friend who's perents are mormons. the only thing she ever complains about is visiting them, because mormons don't drink here is a link, that i quickly searched for, about their religion. i don't think that it is fair for you to call their religion stupid, or call them ignorant. Who are we to say that one religion is better than another? "Judge not, lest ye be judged." (Matthew 7:1) as for debate, i don't do religious debates. i am not going to tell someone that they are wrong for having different beliefs than me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
auggybendoggy December 13, 2003 Author Share auggybendoggy Member December 13, 2003 knock I understand your defensivness. I don't mean to make them sound stupid. I'm just trying to emphasize that if people believe they will fly to a comet by killing themselves with bags full of insecticide because some cat (guy) told them they would and they don't ask "are you sure...how do you know?" then they are ignorant of truth. Ignorant obviously means to ignore. If I ignore the speed limit for children crossing the street from 2:00-4:00 pm and I race down the street at 100 mph during that time. I am ignorant for not paying attention to street signs. I am informed from the DMV that signs along the roads will guide me to drive safely. They cannot be ignored. If one claims to read a book of a religion and ignores the book he claims to read he too is ignorant. Like cannibal, even he is not a believer yet finds mormonism to be absurd. I follow suit. Unless hypocracy is a positive character trait then one must believe in truth. I know no one who practices hypocracy and states it. What I mean is there are no religions I know of that preach "were hypocrites, thats what our religion is about. We say one thing and do another". I'm simply saying that since we all claim to be true, should we not be reasonable and real with Gods word. Even mormons believe the OT is Gods word. They claim the NT is Gods word. I am a protestand (baptist) and I think our church, calvary chapels, pentecostal, methodist and many more have many problems with doctrine. But they admit it and are willing to discuss issues upon these matters. Mormons are not willing to discuss these issues. From my experience (I attended a mormon church for 3 months to learn from them) they are ignorant of facts of scripture. For example they ignore Genesis when the ONE GOD says "let us make man in our image". No response. Yet they firmly deny the doctrine of the trinity. I don't expect them to embrace it but at least question the NON TRINITY views by asking a bishop "why does God say this". So again sorry to offend. I like mormon people I've had friends years ago who were mormons but that does not mean I can sit back and say all is well cause they are my freinds. I must be true to truth. I'm not saying I know all truth but if something blatant is there I will question it and if it does not follow logic I toss it out. Sincerely, Auggybendoggy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Watchtower December 14, 2003 Share Watchtower Member December 14, 2003 knock I understand your defensivness. I don't mean to make them sound stupid. I'm just trying to emphasize that if people believe they will fly to a comet by killing themselves with bags full of insecticide because some cat (guy) told them they would and they don't ask "are you sure...how do you know?" then they are ignorant of truth. I am a protestand (baptist) and I think our church, calvary chapels, pentecostal, methodist and many more have many problems with doctrine. But they admit it and are willing to discuss issues upon these matters. Mormons are not willing to discuss these issues. From my experience (I attended a mormon church for 3 months to learn from them) they are ignorant of facts of scripture. For example they ignore Genesis when the ONE GOD says "let us make man in our image". No response. Yet they firmly deny the doctrine of the trinity. I don't expect them to embrace it but at least question the NON TRINITY views by asking a bishop "why does God say this". So again sorry to offend. I like mormon people I've had friends years ago who were mormons but that does not mean I can sit back and say all is well cause they are my freinds. I must be true to truth. I'm not saying I know all truth but if something blatant is there I will question it and if it does not follow logic I toss it out. Sincerely, Auggybendoggy How is this any different from any other set of religious beliefs though? You say I can't fly to a comet, yet your same faith tells me I can move a mountain. You say fact. All of what we are talking about is speculation. SOmething someone wrote down because someone told them to. Does God say in your ear, "Do this, Do that, I command you."? THis would be fact. Infact some of your own faith Believe God talks to them directly. They say men were made in Gods image. Was god apelike? Was Jesus dark skinned? Did the dinosaurs come After adam and eve pupolated the planet with man? To me people who believe in Genesis and Creation are ignoring the facts in front of them or try to explain them away again ignoring their Blatant truths. They cite these few Mysterious and seemingly impossible scenarios that they figure could only happen by some devine intervention. And they are hypocritical. They stat Thou shall not Kill, then go on crusades to convert and end up "saving" many souls by killing them. To me, there's more ignoring the facts in the Christian and similar controlling religions than just about anything going on the account of what someone is telling them. Not by the actual hand or voice of God. Many adulterated versions of a story and text handed down through a few centuries.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
auggybendoggy December 14, 2003 Author Share auggybendoggy Member December 14, 2003 (edited) Watch, Understood. Indeed there is faith involved which superceeds science in our thinking. But in the realm of religion where both deem to have beliefs in a book they should be able to address everything about the book. You speak of differences of science and spirit. It's apples and oranges. Mormons are on the same playing field concerning believing therfore it can be debated. I cannot debate with you the issue of faith or character of God if you don't believe there is a God. But if you claim to believe in the bible then we can debate about the bible. Concerening facts of evolution I know many other christians (including myself) who dont know the facts are accurate. For example many claim lucy is stable. I don't know where lucy came from...can you prove to me that lucy was not manufactured from Joe Shmo in his garage to disprove the bible. You yourself have to have some faith in the what information is passed on to you. My point is that I don't buy every X-file that is passed on to us. I do believe that this universe is WAY to quantized and complex for it to have just snapped into existence. So I obviously believe there is a creator to this design. A design without a designer? hmmmm? Still yet your point is valid but really does not apply here since mormons claim to believe the NT and the OT. It's part of their faith. So we can discuss this with them. Islamic, Buddhist and likes would not apply here since they don't claim the bible as being the word of God. So how can I claim them ignorant of biblical doctrines....I can't, they dont claim to know or believe it. Hope this helps, Auggy P.S. Whats up man, I havent heard from you for a while. I've been playing matrix on my PC so I've not played CS for a few weeks. Late, Edited December 14, 2003 by auggybendoggy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Watchtower December 14, 2003 Share Watchtower Member December 14, 2003 Yeah i got CoD and have been playing that some.. i've been around ABout Lucy. It's not just one skeleton. And why would many people collaborate and make something like this up. No power to gain, no people to control. Just in the name of knowledge. These skeletons are no speculation. The only debate is how they relate to us and a timeline. They did exist just like dinosaurs that some people still discount as a result of their religious beliefs. I never said there is no God or "oversee'er". I can't say for sure one way or the other.. Now the bible and christianity I have serious doubts. I look at the motives and the circumstances at the time and it was just very convienient to try to explain everything that people were looking for answers for. The bible just dosen't hold up for me. Lets adress this issue. man was first created Then everything else on the planet right? Meaning nothing till man, then everything after.. Right? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
auggybendoggy December 15, 2003 Author Share auggybendoggy Member December 15, 2003 thats debated by many christians. Most fundamentalists believe man was last. Earth, plants and then man and animals. But there are some who think the 7 days are literal 24 hrs days but seperated by thousands to millions of years. My point though is not whether you do believe in God or not. My point is If mormons believe in the bible than I should be able to judge based on the same book. You bring in the "believe in creationism" question regarding faith. Mormons believe in the bible...so do I, so its not at all the same. I can in turn say to you you cannot prove those dinosaur and ancient human bones are not planted by game show hosts around the world who are conspiring to disprove the bible. Sounds ridiculous right? But you still cant prove it. MORMONS believe the bible. So thats my point. Auggy sadamm no more! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chief December 15, 2003 Share Chief Member December 15, 2003 The Free Masons are almost a thousand years old and Mormons are closer to 200. I have two catches with Mormonism 1. is that the prophet that delivered the "new gospel" was illeterate and dictated the words while in a religious trance. 2. is that the church started off endorsing polygamy and embraced it as a fundamental principle of the religion, and then when the federal government refused Utah acceptance into the Union without banning polygamy, the elders said okay and changed their religious beliefs for the luxuries of statehood. I have had a few Mormon friends, two that I lived with at boarding school. They tried to explain things, and I read through their new bible. At any rate it didn't sit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jane December 19, 2003 Share jane Member December 19, 2003 <------ Roman Catholic Its interesting to listen to the mormons talk somtimes. Other times its not. All one has to say to get them to run away, big thick books flying everywhere, is to say "im roman catholic". I dont have any idea why. It works everytime. They find some obscure reason to leave the conversation in the middle of it, and as soon as possible. Its really kinda funny. BTW, watchtower thanks for tearing auggy a new one, he needed that. Remember Auggy, this isnt a forumn where you get to tear apart religion, its a forumn where we discuss the ideas and doctrines and possibilities of religions. I hate the mormon lies just as much as the next guy, but lets not take it so far as to lay down 7, 12-page statistical reports on the wrongs of mormonism.... lol im not gettin down on ya auggy, im just too tired to be nice this morning. Dont you hate it when you wake up with a hangover, but you didnt drink anything the night before? jane Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Playaa December 19, 2003 Share Playaa Member December 19, 2003 I'm not sure Auggy was really "insulting" mormonism as much as he was expressing his frustration with how someone can say they believe something yet ignore parts of it. just like when people say that the Bible has "good values" yet they refuse to pay attention to the parts of it they don't understand. it drives me insane. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jane December 19, 2003 Share jane Member December 19, 2003 rrrrrrrrgr that. Auggy knows that I like to take his view and skew it a bit for my own benefits... lol Joe Cool Strikes again! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
auggybendoggy December 20, 2003 Author Share auggybendoggy Member December 20, 2003 ohh headshot! that hurt! Aug Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jane December 21, 2003 Share jane Member December 21, 2003 oo my main man, i didnt mean any harm! lol Jane+Spiritual stuff= hs for all I guess I need to tone the harshness? You know me babe, Im all bout the poopies and giggles gg auggy 0 jane 1 jane | gfe* *as if I still play the game Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
auggybendoggy December 21, 2003 Author Share auggybendoggy Member December 21, 2003 what do you mean auggy 0 its more like auggy -13 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Watchtower December 21, 2003 Share Watchtower Member December 21, 2003 I wasn't trying to rip auggy a new one either But nice to see u back Jane.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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