Not having fun anymore

[wayfarer]

Well, this topic has been brought up multiple times. I'm sure its very

easy to get your stats bumped up if your always on the winning team.

I know because when I have a good night, my stats go through the roof.

Unfortunately, lately, the only good nights I have been having, aside from

Saturday night customs, is when I'm on the winning side. I don't see how this

is even fun because it becomes difficult to find anyone to kill after the first

minute or so. For obvious reasons its not fun being on the losing side.

Again unfortunately I'm the type of person who always tries to balance

things, to no effect because I'm not a very good player to begin with.

When I entered "team stack" into this site's search engine this is what I got.

It's obvious that I'm not the only one to see this problem.

I just wanted to say this because for the past little while I have found

myself quickly leaving the GC servers because I'm no longer having any fun.

Edited November 3, 2005 by wayfarer

[anonymo]

This makes me unhappy...I don't usually notice all this team stacking people say is rampant...not that I'm saying it doesn't happen, but it's nearly impossible to deal with when it happens. Yeah we can even the teams but it's usually the case that the teams are pretty much even in players but not necessarily in skill, something we can't do anything about.

 

I think the only thing we can really do is to enforce the skunk rule...that being said I'm unsure why it's not scripted on the server to change maps at 7-0. There are even times when I think the map should be changed at 5-0. It bothers me the most when you're at 6-0 and the losing team somehow manages to win a round, usually because the other team just started goofing off, then they go on to win the rest ending in 10-1. I mean what's the point?

 

At the end of the day I'd rather play best out of 10, or 5 or 7...whatever it is it would make matches much closer

[strangefamous]

This is why I've always been a strong advocater of Only Auto Assign. I think we tried it for a bit but there was too much whining.

 

Remove the option to choose your team and you'll still have stacks but at least it's random.

[stutters]

This is why I've always been a strong advocater of Only Auto Assign. I think we tried it for a bit but there was too much whining.

 

Remove the option to choose your team and you'll still have stacks but at least it's random.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

^ i'm with him/her.

 

...or using the PTBx part of this

[akaM2]

Team Stacking is gonna happen on basically every map and every server. Its CS, Ive never been on a server where TS was not happening. Obviously some less than others but you have to try to combat it.

 

Rally your team together, in a pub you can basically win every round by rushing, aka tell your whole team to rush b, or smoke b and rush A. Most pubbers like it when someone jumps on the mic and takes control.

When its 3-0 or 4-0 and theres a good guy on the other team, ask him if he can come over. Most people that are at the top of that team get bored winning, i know it sounds stupid but if there "stat whores" they wont want to be on a team thats rolling over the other team, they will want more chances to kill. Atleast I do

 

Changing the server to automatically changing it at 7-0 or 6-0 will not stop teamstacking, it will just go on in the next map. Unfortanetly team stacking is never going to go away in CS, we can only try to contain it.

[akaM2]

This is why I've always been a strong advocater of Only Auto Assign. I think we tried it for a bit but there was too much whining.

 

Remove the option to choose your team and you'll still have stacks but at least it's random.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

but when we tried this it removed the right for us to change teams even when we were on the winning team. It takes away any chance of us undoing (is that a word) the stack.

[Laz.e.rus]

That was the biggest problem we had actualy. At some times, you could watch it all auto itself out, then jsut go to a different server becuase you knew EXACTLY what was gonna happen with those teams and no-one could do anything about it.

*******************************************

edit:

 

Heres another issue I have with the team staxxoring thing:

People enjoy winning ( its a competitive game). Most Dont enjoy losing.

 

But NO MATTER WHAT, 50% will ALWAYS be on the losing team and there is nothing anyone can ever do about it.

Then theres those that say they got skunked 4 maps in a row due to stackage. I find it hard to believe that the teams were exactly the same across 4 maps and re-joins. Sounds more like a really bad luck-streak.

 

And as far as other servers, GC are the only servers Ive ever seen where team stacking is actvely monitored with admins and sooo many regs working to keep it fun!!

Now ...a 24 hour dust server with one team at 109 and the other at 6... THATS stacking!!! LoL But theres no-one there to care or change anything about it.

Edited November 3, 2005 by Laz.e.rus

[stutters]

...so what about PTBx? think of it as eric's team balance, but still in development.

[Laz.e.rus]

But still....

 

Ill be willing to bet that 50% of the players on that server are gonna lose!!

The difference? The people that tried really hard and did well get swapped so it was all for nothing...yay.

And that is the ultimate problem with this issue I believe.

[stutters]

some people aren't aware of the issue, or play that whole oblivious thing really well. i think the chaffing is coming from the people that don't bother to switch, and forced balance through etb/ptb makes it happen. i think by the time admins ask someone to swap, get their attention, ask them again, and reason why they should switch, people are disconnecting. this kinda skips that whole process, and does it mathematically. assuming it works as described, which i dunno. if people are open to it, and the elders give the nod, west is on the guinea pig list.

[Laz.e.rus]

But...

disconnecting to go where? A server where they always win?

Balancing the NUMBEr of players is easy. Several plugins can handle that and it should be done.

Balancing who is winning...ick

 

The only way a REAL teamstack problem can truly occur is if say:

M2,cujo,sim,hollywood are on the same side and (probably) trounce the other team. Is this bad ? NO!!!

IF you said yes...What if they werent regs/members and jsut happenedd to join without knowing each other?

Now the REAL issue.. is if those same 4 are on the same team again next map. They already know what happened last time. And the next map, and the next map......thats an actual problem.

edit: and even then its only a problem if there isnt enough skill and coordinating on the other team for each map. If those same people are on one side, what about the other 8 players? If they are really nubbish and all 12 on the other team are decent , the "stacked" team will probably lose.

Edited November 3, 2005 by Laz.e.rus

[stutters]

etb/ptb doesn't balance the number of players, it balances the skill. say m2, cujo, sim, and hollywood auto join and end up on the same team. it'd be nice to think they're paying attention to it, but is it fair to think they're engrossed in the game and objectives more than "who was on my team last round?" i'm not in that skill bracket, so i dunno. i just think automatic team balance lets us focus on just playing the game.

 

just my two cents. like i said, it's not a huge problem on west, but i always see the storm brewing.

 

edit - good discussion

[Laz.e.rus]

I guess what runs me wrong is this :

Its a competetive game. To try and make it so that it is always even sounds... communist? No one should ever gain an advatage over the other...etc.

[wayfarer]

The reason I brought this up is simple. People who are not GC members

have complained about stacking on our servers quite a bit lately. This

has happened before, but I have REALLY noticed it the past couple of

weeks. Now I can see what your saying about M2, Cujo, Sim, & Hollywood

all being on the same team & not realizing it. If that were the case, I

would'nt say anything. The above 4 mentioned players are outstanding players

who, whenever I have played with them, ensured the teams were balanced.

Players of this calibre can do that just by joining the losing team. What I am

talking about is when I join and it is CLEARLY VISIBLE that, although the teams

are even numberwise, they are far from even skill wise. Nothing will happen

until it is already 5,6,or7 to 0. Then the top few players will switch & it becomes

a skunk for the other side. I don't know what can be done about this. By the time

you've played 4 or 5 rounds its usually pretty obvious whats happening.

[Fatty]

I played one map last night and unstacked a team. We (me and my new team I spawn naded on my first round on) still lost 10-7 (was a 4-0 start) but it was still fun.

 

If it's still stacked, ask someone personally to help by name. I find this really helps. i.e. "Shodan, help me out here, bro." Many, including myself, take pride in switching the momentum of a game by helping the other team. Just communicate before you're agitated.

 

As far as stats, if you're talking about the game statistics on the web....forget them. I haven't looked at a stat forever....I'm not convinced there's much constructive anything in them, only because I don't enter a server to compare myself to others.

[farmerisme]

I played one map last night and unstacked a team.  We (me and my new team I spawn naded on my first round on) still lost 10-7 (was a 4-0 start) but it was still fun.

 

If it's still stacked, ask someone personally to help by name.  I find this really helps.  i.e. "Shodan, help me out here, bro."  Many, including myself, take pride in switching the momentum of a game by helping the other team.  Just communicate before you're agitated.

 

As far as stats, if you're talking about the game statistics on the web....forget them.  I haven't looked at a stat forever....I'm not convinced there's much constructive anything in them, only because I don't enter a server to compare myself to others.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Yeah I took that nade on the lip fatty.

[ConGregation]

Play not for the points, but rather for the experience

 

-a well know ConGrucianism

[AIMbot 2.0 BETA Tester]

This is why I've always been a strong advocater of Only Auto Assign. I think we tried it for a bit but there was too much whining.

 

Remove the option to choose your team and you'll still have stacks but at least it's random.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

^ i'm with him/her.

 

...or using the PTBx part of this

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Wait, this was one done then removed? I hate the glock, but I'd rather be stuck with it and more fair team than it on a loosing team. I really see very few people switching teams, GC or regs. I have even asked people to on a few occasions and just had silence returned. This really does seem to be getting alot worse.

Edited November 3, 2005 by AIMbot 2.0 BETA Tester

[strangefamous]

Indeed it can be turned off, it was very early in sources life when we tried this. Maybe now we can remove the option without removing the right to switch teams?

[Fatty]

It was unsuccessful because it then removed the ability to even the teams, and the slaughters continued. You'd think it would work but we gave it a shot.

[PYRO]

Stacking skill wise happens enough to be frustrating, but it is mostly on just certain maps where one side tends to have the advantage where it shines. Everyone knows Aztec is CT favored and Italy is T favored. It tends to be my bad luck of auto join that always shoots me to T on Aztec and CT on Italy. I am not saying the maps are too imbalanced, because I have won on the harder side many times. I look on the stats page and see rounds won/lost and its pretty even. I always hit auto assign and am almost always on the tougher of the two sides on any given map. I take my lumps on the losing team like everyone else. Sometimes i think Auto assign button should just say T. Enough ranting, its all just a game in the end, just shoot kill and die.

[Terribleone]

Well when i am on... i either ask the top guys to change teams or i will get someone to change teams to balance the map out at 6-0 and etc... lately when i am on i have been seeing a lot of close maps 8-10 7-10 9-10 9-9 etc i been trying to do my best on keeping teams even the thing is when i am on the losing team its usualy because no one wants to listen to whoever is calling out rushes or holding bombsites or nobody is stepping up to figure out how to win then i step up and try to get things going a lot of time its not about k:d ratios its TEAMWORK!

[Brillow_Head]

One thing that complicates maters on the sided maps is the fact that those that want to be on the easy side will choose that side right away.

 

So, the people who want to be fair auto-assign will automatically go the the harder sides because the chosers will create the imbalance. I've tried (only once) to autoswitch entire teams before round start of round 0. I recieved flak from some, laughter from others...but in the end the peeps who wanted on the easy side eventually went to the easy side. It was an experiment in futility

[farmerisme]

Since my PC loads the new maps slowly I often miss the pistol round and end up autojoining to the 'hard' team for maps. I do not mind this. I enjoy playing from behind and often find that a comeback is much, much more satisfying than a 10-2 win.

[Vovik]

I think those 'easy sides' are just an excuse for a lazy play. If you want to play lazy you are going to play lazy on either side, just so happens you can't be lazy on the 'harder side'. If everyone played with a sense of strategy and actually tried to win I think all maps would be balanced out. YES, even aztec and dust.

I used to complain about teamstacking too but I think its a waste of time. Learn how to play, get your team to rally and you are going to have fun. If you want to play lazy, then you WILL be losing and you won't have fun.

 

*btw, 'you' here is directed at everybody, not directly at you wayf...

Edited November 4, 2005 by Vovik