Are you a fighter?

[*BiGBonES**]

Any fighters in here? Well I need some advice because I keep finding myself in tricky situations, wednesday night being a particulary nasty one. I'm not trying to promote violence or fighting in anyway, nor try and use these tips to go up to innocent people and cause harm. They are primarily for the use of self defence when another person starts a fight on you.

 

I'm going to put forward a few roles, and hopefully someone can advise me in what to do in them. (in all roles escape is not an option)

 

1) Theres one guy infront of you, about the same height, and a fight is about to take place. You have the first move. What should you do?

 

2) Your surrounded by 3 guys (what happened to me last night) - you have the first move. How do you deal with them, do you take out the biggest or smallest one first? What do you do when you find yourself on the floor?

 

3) Your in a fighting situation, and instead of getting the 'fighting adrenaline rush', you get the 'flight' adrenaline rush, but flight is not an option. What happens if you totally freeze due to being scared? How do you change yourself from the weak person standing there into the beast that you know you can become?

[wayfarer]

Have you considered a martial art? I have taken Karate before.

The right school with the right teachers can and will address all of

your concerns. Look for someone who is there to teach. Not get

you signed up and paid.

[*BiGBonES**]

I really wanted to start karate at the start of college but I found that I didnt have the time to do everything I do now aswell as a martial art. I believe I can punch, kick elbow and knee people quite well. I had a boxing bag at home that I used to use at least once a week so I can deliver a blow to an idle bag. I've played 'soccer' for 10 years non stop so I sure can deliver a powerful kick.

 

I just don't have any plans. I know you cant plan a fight, but you should be able to have an idea of what you are going to do in the first instance to give that initial shock and get the advantage. This is what I lack. I dont know if I should deliver a full on blow to a persons head, rugby tackle them, kick them or what.

[Unclean]

A martial art of some kind would help you out the best. When I was taking Shodokan karate, they taught us techniques for fighting multiple opponents. I'll give you a few ways to address the situations you posed. All of them involve being able to throw a fast, powerful punch from a standing position. Try practicing standing up straight, then stepping forward and simultaneously throwing a punch at your punching bag. But always remember: fighting is the VERY LAST RESORT.

 

1. Fighting someone of the same build, you have first move: it depends on how serious you are at taking the person down and keeping them down. If this is a life-or-death kinda thing, you could punch the guy in the throat. It takes something like 8lbs of force to collapse someone's windpipe, and they're not getting up after that. The next step up from that is a hit to the sternum. Aim for the little divot where the ribs meet at the bottom of the ribcage. A good hit here will knock the wind out of someone, and hence the fight is over. Another one is to throw a straight punch right to the nose. With any luck, you'll break the nose, and a natural reaction to that is for the eyes to well up with tears. Pain + vision blurring = very ineffective fighter.

 

2. 3 guys - very tricky. The odds are definitely not in your favor. All you have on your side is the fear of the unknown and the first strike. You need to first break out of being surrounded. Try to knock the wind out of the biggest guy, then kick the second biggest guy square in the nuts. Some people say this is cheap, but you know what? So is outnumbering a guy 3 to 1. Then it's you vs the littlest guy, and he may either fight you to stick up for his downed friends or realize that he doesn't stand a chance and back off.

 

3. This is a tough one. Maybe the first thing to keep in mind is that while you might scared, there's a good chance the guy on the other side of your stance is just as scared (or maybe more!). You are unknown to that person. Just think of ways you can use that to your advantage.

 

/edit: you can never plan an entire fight, but you can always plan at least the first move or two.

Edited March 31, 2006 by Unclean

[Unclean]

Double post! One other thing I can tell you is kind of a neat trick... how to stop someone from pushing you. There are two ways of doing it, and I'll try to describe them.

 

You can always tell when someone's about to push you because they pull their arms back, and their shoulders go with it a little. This makes it extremely easy to stop them. This technique also don't hurt anyone, so you can practice with a friend or something. And you can have them try to push you as hard as they can, they won't be able to move you an inch though.

 

Method 1: when they start the push, bring your hands into a praying position (but not quite touching) between the pusher's arms. Move your hands away from eachother, and it pushes the attacker's arms out wide. Someone attempting to push you will stumble forward because they're expecting some resistance. You can use their stumble in a lot of different ways (punch, kick, psychological effect, etc).

 

Method 2: when they start the pushing motion, bring your arm up so your forearm is facing them and sweep from right to left (if you're using your left arm) or left to right (if you're using your right arm). They'll lunge in the direction you're sweeping your arm towards, so that gives you an opportunity to attack, mess with their head, etc.

 

Please note: if you're practicing with a friend, don't punch them after stopping their push. They tend to get a little salty if you do.

[wayfarer]

Bigbones, I'm gonna tell you something here. I've seen some videos of

after hours around London bars. (I'm assuming where this is coming form)

You want my advice? Seek professional help! If you can't do that I would seiously

reconsider any situation that involves three opponents. It is an unfair advantage

that could find you regretting not eating your pride. If you absoloutly can not get

professional help, here is a fantastic move that I learned in Karate. First of all

always wait for your opponent to commit to his move. (unless it's 3 to 1. It is then

a free for all, anything goes, ANYTHING!) Generally first move will be a forward punch

with the right fist. Either left or right is irrelivant, once you see this coming (do what

you need to ensure you see this as it is coming!!) See this? The guy with the red belt should be able to use his right arm, wrist to wrist,

to deflect the oncoming blow over his right shoulder. Once completed your opponents right side is

completely vulnerable to a complete counter-attack. At this point a knee to any part of the mid-section

will distract him long enough for you land the knock out. Where? Head? Chest? NO! Once this

is complete, you next objective is the knee! This person has now put his full force on his right

knee. Kick straight to the side of the right knee and believe me, this fight is OVER!

Now, after saying that, MAKE TIME to learn this the correct way!

[duma]

Well, I used to work security at my univesity. We had to have martial art training, and various other strategies to deal with situations like this.

 

I can sum up 1 month of training x 3 years of doing it:

 

1. Preventive measure:

a. Don't let yourself get into the situation (stay in well lit areas, avoid drunks - note that doesnt work with security, etc)

b. If you are in the situation, use your brain to get you out

 

2. If a fight is certain

a. Hit the soft spots (groin, eyes, nose), then b

b. Run

[whudats]

Unclean said it best: Fighting should be the last resort.

 

As it is, this is not always possible. I prefer to let the other guy make the first move. While this can be tricky, it gives you the opportunity to react. You can do a lot with a guy's momentum and not have to spend a lot energy or leave yourself exposed. Depending on the situation, it can also give you the reason of self-defense if the law gets involved.

 

I hope I don't find myself in a fight ever again. I took kung fu a long time ago, but have had a lot of hand-to-hand training in the Army. Unfortunately, all that training is about killing and disabling opponents. My fear is that I would seriously injure someone, so I just avoid the situations altogether. Oh yeah, and people tend to leave you alone when you are big (6'5", 240).

 

As far as fighting though, if you find yourself in one, there are no cheap shots. There is nothing unfair about kicking a guy in the groin, pulling his hair, poking his eyes, etc. You need to take advantage of every opportunity to disable the guy - make it so he can't hurt you.

 

Your elbows and knees are the hardest striking parts of your body. Use them when you can. I would advise against kicking because, unless you've had training (and no, not football), you can find yourself WAY off balance and in worse shape than you started. You need to use your judgement about kicking someone on the ground. If you get guys on the ground, then it's time to move out.

 

Don't try anything elaborate. Stick to the basics, keep your balance, keep situational awareness, and get out at the first possible moment.

 

One last thing: Never be afraid to headbutt.

[*BiGBonES**]

Ok thanks for the advice guys, ofcourse any more is always welcome. I may go to some summer courses just to learn a few basics that I can build on.

 

On wednesday night-

I was in the student union night club, drunk but minding my own business, and then some boys ran into my girlfriend, they may have been having an arguement amoungst themselves. I pushed them away just to get them out of our area, then turned around and carried on dancing. I look up a minute later facing the direction to where i pushed them and there were 4 guys in my face shouting why are you pushing me. I could tell that this was it, so I took the first move and punched the first guy right in the face. After that I blacked out and dont remember any of the fight, and then I find myself being held by loads of secuirty guards before I left.

 

Apart from being kicked in the head by one guy, slipping over in a puddle of alcohol and smashing my own head on the floor, I think I did a good job (from what I'm told). Anyhow, I'm covered in bruises so I'm not happy. You can tell these people were the type of people that look for fights, think they run the world etc, think they are untouchable. We call them 'rude boys'.

 

Last night-

Last night, and you'll probably all agree that this was rather foolish, I went out looking for them with a few friends. After a night of watching one of the guys, he was making a phone call in the stair case, so I went up to him and laid two punches right on his cheek, below his eye. He's lucky I didnt break his nose, but I learnt a lot about myself that night because I know im not going to stoop to his level and completely get cheap moves on my opponents. Yea I punched him when he was not looking and was totally unaware that he was going to have any trouble, but it served him right. I think his phone smashed on the ground as well, hopefully it was expensive.

[witt]

Do your best to defuse the situation, and when that's not possible, I'm with whudats:

As far as fighting though, if you find yourself in one, there are no cheap shots.

 

If it's just one guy, just hit him in the nose or right below the sternum. If you really want to hurt him, jack him in the throat real quick (but not too hard, you don't want to kill anyone).

 

If you're outnumbered, and can't get away, I would try to hurt one person as badly and as quickly as possible. Hopefully that will discourage anyone else from fighting. Definitely break a nose, strike someone in the throat, or kick the side of a large person's knee in. Use a bottle or a glass, or push them into something breakable. Break something or draw blood.

 

But honestly, just avoid it at all costs. One thing I've learned about fights is that whether you win or lose, you're probably going to get hurt and arrested (either a broken hand or a broken nose, my coach used to say). And the people you're going to impress aren't people you really need to worry about anyways.

[Clueless]

Lots of good advise here, so i'll just briefly give my point of view.

 

If I were faced with 2 or more opponents, and escape isn't an option, I would quickly determine which of the group I feel better about fighting 1 on 1, then, my first move would be to disable the others, very quickly, and without concern for them, remember, they are the ones attacking you, and you have no idea what thier intentions are, your life could be in danger, so act accordingly.

 

A couple of the most effective, and damaging moves are the above mentioned throat strike, and one of my favorites, spearing the eyes with a straight fingered jab, nothing fancy, just keep em straight, and rigid. Those 2 things could quickly take down 2 guys, leaving you with your chosen 1 on 1 match up.

 

I think the biggest concern is quickness, not just movement, but action, you have to determine quickly if escape is an option, if it isnt, then dont hesitate, git r' done.

 

Other things to look for, someone standing with a straight leg, that would be an easy first target, a good swift kick on or above the knee will take him down, just do it hard enough, dont worry about him, he is trying to harm you, so when you kick it, imagine that your kicking behind his leg, not at it, that helps follow through instead of snapping back at contact.

 

Just keep in simple, have a few favorite techniques, nothing fancy. An adreneline rush like that means NO FINE MOTOR SKILLS, so take all that cool crap you see in the movies, and forget it, lol.

 

If you want to look into a martial art for self defense, and youre not interested in all the sport that goes with it, I suggest you look into Kenpo, it is all business, no sport, no fancy acrobatic kicking. I was a student of Kenpo for 3 years, it was very cool, I have also taken other forms such as Tai Kwon Do, and Karate, which were good fitness and disipline, but I felt they were fairly useless as a fighting art, well, at least until you spend 10 years of you life on it. Kenpo will teach you many things you can use immediately.

 

Hope this helps, but even more so, I hope you never have to use anything in this thread.

[Chamberlain]

Martail Arts FTW!

 

http://www.killsometime.com/video/video.asp?ID=197

 

No advice here, I hate fighting.

[CowboyFromHell`X]

You can tell these people were the type of people that look for fights, think they run the world etc, think they are untouchable. We call them 'rude boys'.

 

Most people who go in groups looking to fight one person are called witches (I think that word is filtered).

 

No matter what just remain perfectly calm. When you're too upset you could be too focused on one thing and not be aware of someone attacking you from another angle. Also if you're too upset you can push it too far and injure that person far worse than need be. Do not say to yourself in the situation "I'm going to get clobbered" because you will. They will pick up on that quickly and if they're looking for a fight, they'll look for the person who looks most nervous.

 

The advice I can give you on what to do has already been stated. If you're going to learn self defense (martial arts especially), don't go into it with the attitude of learning how to kick someone's butt. You learn self defense to avoid fighting at all costs. What it does teach you though is if you're in a situation where you have to fight you know you can handle it.

[Vovik]

As far as fighting though, if you find yourself in one, there are no cheap shots. There is nothing unfair about kicking a guy in the groin, pulling his hair, poking his eyes, etc. You need to take advantage of every opportunity to disable the guy - make it so he can't hurt you.

I disagree totally. If it's just a fight, for pride or whatever, how can you be proud of yourself if you punch another guy in the nuts and then poke his eyes out as he is down on his knees from the nut blow? There are rules to fighting. Unwritten ones but still. Doesn't mean you can't hurt him though.

On another hand if the fight is a life and death situation (which is almost never is) then it's a different story. But then, wouldn't you rather bring guns to that? (not trying to promote violence here)

Then another thing, usually a fight is over some misunderstanding, usually can be resolved with a smart mouth. If people are just looking for trouble and fighting then you gotta either avoid them or bring your whole crew.

BigB, you should take some speciality classes. None of the karate or the likes though. There are special classes on how to handle yourself in the like situations back home. They teach where the weak parts of the body are and how to take advantage on that. You should prolly ask around.

[Unclean]

As far as fighting though, if you find yourself in one, there are no cheap shots. There is nothing unfair about kicking a guy in the groin, pulling his hair, poking his eyes, etc. You need to take advantage of every opportunity to disable the guy - make it so he can't hurt you.

I disagree totally. If it's just a fight, for pride or whatever, how can you be proud of yourself if you punch another guy in the nuts and then poke his eyes out as he is down on his knees from the nut blow? There are rules to fighting. Unwritten ones but still. Doesn't mean you can't hurt him though.

If it was a 1v1, yeah, that'd be cheap. But if it's a 3v1 (like BB suggested earlier), then I don't see anything cheap about it. To make it a fair fight, 1-2 of the people have to be disabled. It becomes unfair the moment 3 people gang up on him, not when he kicks one guy in the nuts.

 

On another hand if the fight is a life and death situation (which is almost never is) then it's a different story.

What about those times when a fight *becomes* a life-or-death situation? People get beaten to death all the time, especially when it involves being outnumbered. One person starts, another continues kicking, etc. A body can only take so much damage.

[Vovik]

i agree 3on1 is not a fair fight, and if you're by yourself you shouldn't fight fair against them either. Anything goes.

[appalachian_fox]

FWIW: Are there ways to avoid these tricky situations? Experience is a great instructor. Could you have swallowed your pride and avoided a dangerous situation? Anytime someone has to get hurt (even if they HAVE to) the situation wasn't solved ideally, even if you walk away with only a bit of elbow inflammation.

 

I appreciate that you don't want to go out picking fights (That's a good thing) but be aware that it only takes one person to start a fight, and maybe you can give that person reason to not start it in the first place. Good luck!

 

Of course, there are plenty of opinions here on what to do when someone "has to get hurt," so I won't add to the volumes.

[CowboyFromHell`X]

Are submissions useful? Does anyone here know any submissions? Where would I go if I wanted to learn them? Just incase you're on the ground and wouldn't be able to land a punch.

Edited April 13, 2006 by CowboyFromHell

[whudats]

As far as fighting though, if you find yourself in one, there are no cheap shots. There is nothing unfair about kicking a guy in the groin, pulling his hair, poking his eyes, etc. You need to take advantage of every opportunity to disable the guy - make it so he can't hurt you.

I disagree totally. If it's just a fight, for pride or whatever, how can you be proud of yourself if you punch another guy in the nuts and then poke his eyes out as he is down on his knees from the nut blow? There are rules to fighting. Unwritten ones but still.

Man, if I'm in a fight, then I know that I have done everything in my power to avoid it, and that it WON'T be for 'pride or whatever,' and therefore there will be no rules. I know that I won't be in a fight to earn the respect of the crowd or to make myself feel good knowing that I didn't break some 'unwritten rule.' There is no such thing as 'just a fight' for me.

 

Honestly I can't see myself in a fight unless it involves someone trying to perpetrate a crime against me or a loved one.

[Vovik]

As far as fighting though, if you find yourself in one, there are no cheap shots. There is nothing unfair about kicking a guy in the groin, pulling his hair, poking his eyes, etc. You need to take advantage of every opportunity to disable the guy - make it so he can't hurt you.

I disagree totally. If it's just a fight, for pride or whatever, how can you be proud of yourself if you punch another guy in the nuts and then poke his eyes out as he is down on his knees from the nut blow? There are rules to fighting. Unwritten ones but still.

Man, if I'm in a fight, then I know that I have done everything in my power to avoid it, and that it WON'T be for 'pride or whatever,' and therefore there will be no rules. I know that I won't be in a fight to earn the respect of the crowd or to make myself feel good knowing that I didn't break some 'unwritten rule.' There is no such thing as 'just a fight' for me.

 

Honestly I can't see myself in a fight unless it involves someone trying to perpetrate a crime against me or a loved one.

More power to you. However, I stand by what I said.

[tkc]

Hmmm, as for me fighting is a always a last resort...unless I feel that a friend or family member is in trouble then I will instigate the fight to help out them. As for cheap shots, i find it absolutely wrong to kick a man in the groin or pull hair or poke their eyes.

 

As for strategies, personally I feel the best way to fight someone is to keep them as close to you as possible, because not many people know how to strike in close and if you are in a fight and they land a punch or kick it will not hurt as much as if they had the opportunity to put all of their weight behind them.

 

As for submissions, either learn a martial art or in my case I did Olympic Wrestling for about 8 years and that taught me how to defend while standing as well as how to defend while your opponent has the stronger position.

 

Just curious to know, how many people posting here have actually fought someone in a fair 1 vs 1 or who have had to deal with multiple enemies at a time.

[All Kill3r]

I trained in freestlye kickboxing for 9 years and had quite a few street brawls/ fraternity brawls in my day. I'd say you need to search deep down and find the rage you need to do what needs to be done. Put the fear of god in those kids.

 

Size means nothing, nadda.

 

You yourself have to throw out any fear you have of geting hurt or hurting someone else. There is NO room for sensitivity, you have to break ppl literally sometimes. I know it's not pleasent but i've been in the shoes your walking and sometimes there's no choice.

 

If your ever on the ground you need to do whatever you have to to get up, your very vulnerable on the ground with very limited options. Without training even fewer options.

 

3v1 might or might not be a fair fight. It just depends how you handle the situation next time. Fights don't have to be knock down drag out. 1 hit is all it takes, just put it where it's going to count and punch through them, not at them. Straight hard, fast punches do the job, no windup here i come punches.

 

Hit a guy in the face 1 time so hard his eye fell out. 11 grand hospital bill.

 

When i was 13 i had 8 people come to my home to beat me down. In the end me and my 14 year old brother came out on top. If you something worth fighting over you will win, everytime i ever got into a fight i fought like it was for my life. It never failed.

 

Are submissions useful? Does anyone here know any submissions? Where would I go if I wanted to learn them? Just incase you're on the ground and wouldn't be able to land a punch.

 

Theres whole arts focused around ground combat. Jujitsu/Hapkedo are the 2 biggest arts that focus on hand to hand combat on the ground. If you ever watched the Ultimate fighting challenge fights on TV and have heard of the Gracie family then you will understand what i mean. The Gracie's center on taking their opponent to the ground then going to work on them. Jujitsu is what your looking for, it's deadly.

 

On another hand if the fight is a life and death situation (which is almost never is) then it's a different story.

 

I truely don't mean to offend anyone but if you go into a fight with that attitude you will loose. Every fight is deadly and should be treated as such IMO.

 

Fighting isn't a good solution to any problem but when it's going to happen it's deadly.

[Nick Soapdish]

always carry a shank, that way you can shank the dude.

 

make sure you ninja vanish too.

Edited April 20, 2006 by Nick Soapdish

[Vovik]

what's a shank?

[whudats]

what's a shank?

A bad golf shot.