MrDuke July 25, 2006 Share MrDuke Member July 25, 2006 I find it extremely disturbing that M2 knows all the words to that song. Please turn in your man-law bible and abdicate your position in the he-man woman hater's club. You now have permission to wear your skirt in public. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wayfarer July 25, 2006 Share wayfarer Member July 25, 2006 I'm not comparing good players to hackers, only newbies and good players, which means that you are really laughing at your own misinterpretation of my post. Your NFL analogy sucks. Why should Michael Jordon be allowed to go on random street courts to dominate the competition? If someone (particularly newbies) is having a casual and fun game, they don't want to have their fun sucked away by someone that is so good that they don't belong there. I don't know much about you M2, but I am assuming you are a CAL or CPL hotshot which would put you in a similiar situation as Michael Jordon. Speak for yourself Ash. Some people enjoy playing against players with really high skill levels. It's really the only way to learn! I consider it an honour to play against people of M2's calibre, and it's especially cool when you learn to keep up. (not that that's happened yet LOL) I'm sure all those basketball players that play with Michael Jorden would agree with me. I certainly don't hear any complaints. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akaM2 July 25, 2006 Share akaM2 Member July 25, 2006 I find it extremely disturbing that M2 knows all the words to that song. www.google.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stutters July 25, 2006 Share stutters GC Alumni July 25, 2006 It's really the only way to learn! I consider it an honour to play against people of M2's calibre, and it's especially cool when you learn to keepup. that's a negative ghostrider, the pattern is full. I find it extremely disturbing that M2 knows all the words to that song. www.google.com oh, that's like, cheating. i knew those lyrics from countless sing-a-longs with my NES, top gun, and goose talking me into the carrier approach. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrDuke July 25, 2006 Share MrDuke Member July 25, 2006 I find it extremely disturbing that M2 Stutters knows all the words to that song. Please turn in your man-law bible and abdicate your position in the he-man woman hater's club. You now have permission to wear your skirt in public. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akaM2 July 25, 2006 Share akaM2 Member July 25, 2006 This is what I call a target rich environment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
farmerisme July 25, 2006 Share farmerisme Member July 25, 2006 Skills are honestly achieved. Hacks are deception. I still have fun even when I play people much better than me. I think having good players on ADDS to the fun, does not detract from it. If everyone had an aimbot (like it came with the game or was used by EVERYONE) it would no longer be a hack. So that arguement of yours sucks ash. It is silly to handicap good players or give help to lousy ones. That would RUIN the fun IMO, not aid in it. I rarely, rarely see anyone bad/noobish that comes to GC... even on Recrud which is pretty competitive... get hounded about their lack of skill. People will help them for the most part. They eventually get better if they stick to it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lunk July 25, 2006 Share Lunk Member July 25, 2006 <sniff sniff> Hotshot, you stink. <crash and burn> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akaM2 July 25, 2006 Share akaM2 Member July 25, 2006 This thread has been approved by the hotshot. That's right! Ice... man. I am dangerous. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lunk July 25, 2006 Share Lunk Member July 25, 2006 Where have all the good men gone And where are all the gods? Where's the street-wise Hercules To fight the rising odds? Isn't there a white knight upon a fiery steed? Late at night I toss and turn and dream of what I need I need a hero I'm holding out for a hero 'til the end of the night He's gotta be strong And he's gotta be fast And he's gotta be fresh from the fight I need a hero I'm holding out for a hero 'til the morning light He's gotta be sure And it's gotta be soon And he's gotta be larger than life Somewhere after midnight In my wildest fantasy Somewhere just beyond my reach There's someone reaching back for me Racing on the thunder end rising with the heat It's gonna take a superman to sweep me off my feet I need a hero I'm holding out for a hero 'til the end of the night He's gotta be strong And he's gotta be fast And he's gotta be fresh from the fight I need a hero I'm holding out for a hero 'til the morning light He's gotta be sure And it's gotta be soon And he's gotta be larger than life Up where the mountains meet the heavens above Out where the lightning splits the sea I would swear that there's someone somewhere Watching me Through the wind end the chill and the rain And the storm and the flood I can feel his approach Like the fire in my blood I need a hero I'm holding out for a hero 'til the end of the night He's gotta be strong And he's gotta be fast And he's gotta be fresh from the fight I need a hero I'm holding out for a hero 'til the morning light He's gotta be sure And it's gotta be soon And he's gotta be larger than life Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akaM2 July 25, 2006 Share akaM2 Member July 25, 2006 You never close your eyes anymore when I kiss your lips And there's no tenderness like before in your finger tips You're trying hard not to show it (baby) But baby, baby I know it You've Lost That Lovin' Feeling Oh that Lovin' Feeling You've Lost That Lovin' Feeling Now it's gone gone gone oh oh oh There's no welcome look in your eyes when I reach for you And girl you're starting to criticize little things I do Ooh, it makes me just feel like crying (baby) 'Cause baby something beautiful's dying You've Lost That Lovin' Feeling Oh that Lovin' Feeling You've Lost That Lovin' Feeling Not it's gone gone gone oh oh oh Baby baby I get down on my knees for you (Get down on my knees) If you would only love me like you used to (If you would only love me love me) We had a love, a love that you don't find everyday (A love you don't find) So don't don't don't let it slip away (away) I said baby Baby Baby Baby (I'm beggin you please) I'm begging you please I need your love (I need your love) I need your love So bring it on back (bring it on back) Now bring it on back Now bring it on back You've got to bring back that lovin' feeling Oh that lovin' feeling Bring back that lovin' feeling 'cause it's gone gone gone And I can't go on oh oh oh Bring back that lovin' feeling Oh that lovin' feeling Bring back that lovin' feeling 'cause it's gone gone gone Bring back that lovin' feeling Oh that lovin' feeling Bring back that lovin' feeling 'cause it's gone gone gone Bring back that lovin' feeling Oh that lovin' feeling Bring back that lovin' feeling 'cause it's gone gone gone Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unclean July 25, 2006 Author Share Unclean Member July 25, 2006 This thread has been... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lunk July 25, 2006 Share Lunk Member July 25, 2006 Watching every motion In my foolish lover's game On this endless ocean Finally lovers know no shame Turning and returning To some secret place inside Watching in slow motion As you turn around and say Take my breath away Take my breath away Watching I keep waiting Still anticipating love Never hesitating To become the fated ones Turning and returning To some secret place to hide Watching in slow motion As you turn to me and say Take my breath away Take my breath away Through the hourglass I saw you In time you slipped away When the mirror crashed I called you And turned to hear you say If only for today I am unafraid Take my breath away Take my breath away Watching every motion In this foolish lover's game Haunted by the notion Somewhere there's a love in flames Turning and returning To some secret place inside Watching in slow motion As you turn my way and say Take my breath away Take my breath away Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrDuke July 25, 2006 Share MrDuke Member July 25, 2006 From this moment forward, everytime I see the name Lunk I will associate it with an 80s icon... like John Oats. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lunk July 25, 2006 Share Lunk Member July 25, 2006 From this moment forward, everytime I see the name Lunk I will associate it with an 80s icon... like John Oats. Don't be a hater Duke, you know you sing all these songs in the shower. And spike your hair like Ferris Bueller. So you can imitate the lead singer from "Flock of Seagulls" You closet 80's Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest ash- July 25, 2006 Share Guest ash- Guests July 25, 2006 I'm not comparing good players to hackers, only newbies and good players, which means that you are really laughing at your own misinterpretation of my post. Your NFL analogy sucks. Why should Michael Jordon be allowed to go on random street courts to dominate the competition? If someone (particularly newbies) is having a casual and fun game, they don't want to have their fun sucked away by someone that is so good that they don't belong there. I don't know much about you M2, but I am assuming you are a CAL or CPL hotshot which would put you in a similiar situation as Michael Jordon. Speak for yourself Ash. Some people enjoy playing against players with really high skill levels. It's really the only way to learn! I consider it an honour to play against people of M2's calibre, and it's especially cool when you learn to keep up. (not that that's happened yet LOL) I'm sure all those basketball players that play with Michael Jorden would agree with me. I certainly don't hear any complaints. Speak for yourself wayfarer, some people enjoy playing against pro's and some don't. Ever heard of those mythical people that love to whine when someone is dominating the game with an awp and cry hacker? They don't like to play with pro's obviously. It would be unethical to condemn them for acting out of emotion against someone that is clearly a better player than them because they are unbalancing the game for them. They are not having any fun while the guy with his awp is having an awesome time. What's wrong with this picture? You could derisively (which is characteristic of the CS community as a whole) say that the lesser skilled players should keep playing and get better, but maybe they'd much rather play against evenly skilled opponents and have fun instead (going back to the purpose of this discussion). CS is an enormously popular game with a huge amount of players. Not everyone aspires to be a better player or become a pro. Some people just want to join the game and have fun, not sign up for CAL bootcamp. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akaM2 July 25, 2006 Share akaM2 Member July 25, 2006 I really dont know how to respond to you ash, no matter what I say you are going to think it is ok to hack against good players. Or you think that good players should never pub again. That is purely comical. All these supposed "pros" where in the same situation as the noobs at some time in there cs life. I will gladly leave the pub and ask all good players to leave next time you are on so that everyone can have there fun. I hate to ruin your css time by shooting you. But pure and simple, hacks are hacks, bring them on a gc server, be ready to be banned, even if you are the worst player in the world Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
witt July 25, 2006 Share witt Member July 25, 2006 ok, ash and the Canadians pay attention: MICHAEL JORDAN BULLS Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest ash- July 25, 2006 Share Guest ash- Guests July 25, 2006 (edited) If everyone had an aimbot (like it came with the game or was used by EVERYONE) it would no longer be a hack. So that arguement of yours sucks ash. If you actually read my argument then you will see that I discredited the use of hacks to "level the playing" field in online games in my post and came to the same conclusion you did farmer, please read: How can using cheats not make one get any better at a game? You had to put on training wheels at some point before you could ride a bike no? GTA:SA is a TOUGH game. I don't know anyone who has not cheated in that game. I'm almost towards the end of the game and I have been using the money and gun cheats. Now that I have played the game for so long and know the missions, controls, and gameplay I feel that I can go through it again without cheats (training wheels). Why should this concept be any different for online games? When you play a game with cheats you are still accumulating time and experience in that game. You yell "hack", and everyone gives you every reason ever typed for why it's bad instead of discussing how it can level the playing field if everyone had a legal aimbot handicap. My opinion is that an aimbot handicap does not level the playing field. Why? Because the good players still have years of accumulated reflexes and tactics. Aiming assistance will only make the good players even better as they can find ways to use their newfound powers to their advantage while the newbies are still trying to learn the game. Good players will ALWAYS trump newbies. If you have played any decent console shooter lately with autoaim then you probably know someone that can dominate you even though the playing field is supposedly even. The low sensitivity aimbot that you are talking about would not make a difference in leveling the playing field because the vets still have obscene reflexes -- which newbies cannot match -- that would effectively double their lethality with any kind of aiming assistance. Skills are honestly achieved. Hacks are deception. I still have fun even when I play people much better than me. I think having good players on ADDS to the fun, does not detract from it. It is silly to handicap good players or give help to lousy ones. That would RUIN the fun IMO, not aid in it. I rarely, rarely see anyone bad/noobish that comes to GC... even on Recrud which is pretty competitive... get hounded about their lack of skill. People will help them for the most part. They eventually get better if they stick to it. I did however say that cheating can help you to learn as you play over time and get a feel for the game. Cheats are unethical in a game against humans. If you play with cheats in single player or multiplayer games you will still attain some level of skill because a large part of skill comes from experience with the gameplay itself. If you play a game on easy mode, then your next objective would be to beat it on medium, and then hard, right? Training wheels help you learn. You cannot let any moralistic bias view skills as only being able to be attained by "honest" means. If someone downloads copyrighted books from the internet and learns valuable knowledge and skills from them, he is dishonest for breaking the law. You cannot discredit the skills the attained because he acheived it illegally. He HAS those skills and no amount of badmouthing will cause him to lose those skills. You say it is silly to handicap good players, although I only mentioned a voluntary system like Street Fighter where players can handicap themselves and make the game more challenging. Last but not least, you've been playing CS long enough to know that not every server is like GC nor does the CS world revolve around GC (no offense meant to anyone). I believe GC runs servers with relatively balanced gameplay. Occasional blowouts happen, but when admins are on the game feels fair and even. The same is definitly not true for every server out there unfortunately. Edited July 25, 2006 by ash- Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stutters July 25, 2006 Share stutters GC Alumni July 25, 2006 Top Gun rules of engagement are written for your safety and for that of your team. They are not flexible, nor am I. Is that clear? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unclean July 25, 2006 Author Share Unclean Member July 25, 2006 I really dont know how to respond to you ash, no matter what I say you are going to think it is ok to hack against good players. Or you think that good players should never pub again. That is purely comical. All these supposed "pros" where in the same situation as the noobs at some time in there cs life. I will gladly leave the pub and ask all good players to leave next time you are on so that everyone can have there fun. I hate to ruin your css time by shooting you. But pure and simple, hacks are hacks, bring them on a gc server, be ready to be banned, even if you are the worst player in the world Whoa there, tiger! I think you're missing some of the main points here. I don't think ash- is saying good players should never pub. And I definitely don't think he's gonna start hacking again (this was in his past). This whole thread was started with an entirely different idea, and I was also curious to see if anyone had put any thought into why hacks are bad. I'm not trying to pick on anyone here, but some people just replied with "hacks are bad". I'd ask "why are they bad?" "Because they're bad". Hacks are bad because they're bad, ok. But there were also some really good posts in here, some things that really made some people think (myself included), and unfortunately some personal attacks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest ash- July 25, 2006 Share Guest ash- Guests July 25, 2006 (edited) I really dont know how to respond to you ash, no matter what I say you are going to think it is ok to hack against good players. Or you think that good players should never pub again. That is purely comical. You don't know what I am thinking so stop trying. I can tell you this though, I never said it is ok to hack against good players nor do I think that. These are fallacies that you invented. I discredited the use of hacks as a way to even the game in a previous post, please read: You yell "hack", and everyone gives you every reason ever typed for why it's bad instead of discussing how it can level the playing field if everyone had a legal aimbot handicap. My opinion is that an aimbot handicap does not level the playing field. Why? Because the good players still have years of accumulated reflexes and tactics. Aiming assistance will only make the good players even better as they can find ways to use their newfound powers to their advantage while the newbies are still trying to learn the game. Good players will ALWAYS trump newbies. All these supposed "pros" where in the same situation as the noobs at some time in there cs life. I will gladly leave the pub and ask all good players to leave next time you are on so that everyone can have there fun. I hate to ruin your css time by shooting you. But pure and simple, hacks are hacks, bring them on a gc server, be ready to be banned, even if you are the worst player in the world Yes, every pro was a noob. But does everyone aspire to be a pro? No. Did I mention GC when I said it is unethical for pro's to beat up on newbies? No. Did I say that my fun was ever ruined by players on the GC server? No. Do I think that GC is the epitome of unbalanced gameplay? No. You are just making stuff up now M2 because you cannot come up with a legitimate reply to my posts without resorting to conjecture on what my mind is thinking. I also do not appreciate you challenging me to bring cheats onto the server. I do not cheat in online games anymore. Are you implying that you want to ban me outright? Because that is what it sounds like. Edited July 25, 2006 by ash- Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Batman July 25, 2006 Share Batman Member July 25, 2006 Look what you've done Unclean, shame on you!!! LOL Back to the point, I dont think that cheating just a little bit is ok.. Ive been against cheating for a long long time, letting someone cheat just to make it fair is like welfare for video games.. If the person isnt good, helping them out isnt really helping them at all.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AkUmA July 25, 2006 Share AkUmA Member July 25, 2006 i cant believe this topic is STILL in debate... Dont hack period. Isn't that answer enough? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest ash- July 25, 2006 Share Guest ash- Guests July 25, 2006 Whoa there, tiger! I think you're missing some of the main points here. I don't think ash- is saying good players should never pub. And I definitely don't think he's gonna start hacking again (this was in his past). This whole thread was started with an entirely different idea, and I was also curious to see if anyone had put any thought into why hacks are bad. I'm not trying to pick on anyone here, but some people just replied with "hacks are bad". I'd ask "why are they bad?" "Because they're bad". Hacks are bad because they're bad, ok. But there were also some really good posts in here, some things that really made some people think (myself included), and unfortunately some personal attacks. You are right, the main points have been lost. As soon as you say hack, people say "hacks bad" like a knee jerk reflex, that's what the majority of replies have been. I think I'm the only person that actually put some thought into the subject. It was not my intentions to say good players should never pub, that was someone elses misinterpretation. To sum up what I said: is it ethical for players with a natural advantage ("honest" skills, not artificial) to dominate a game? If so many CS players confuse skilled players with cheaters, then what difference does it make if someone is skilled or not? Cheaters and skilled players alike both hold advantages over lesser opponents. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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