Fatty May 2, 2007 Share Fatty GC Founder May 2, 2007 http://www.ohio.com/mld/ohio/news/17166185.htm You get one post if you like, and respond to the poll...let's not lose this to the political asylum..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akaM2 May 2, 2007 Share akaM2 Member May 2, 2007 Suspension/F in Class is a good punishment. Criminal charges is just silly Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
[LaW]Maverick May 2, 2007 Share [LaW]Maverick Member May 2, 2007 Plain and simple: The kid looked at the test questions...MAYBE the answers...that's kinda unclear in the news story, but that could be construed as cheating. So yeah, he should be punished. However, if this is a first offense (and it sounds like it is) the punishment is usually light--involving a detention and a slap on the wrist. Heck, a friend that got caught cheating in High School got a Saturday detention and was able to re-take the test 'cause it was his first time. The school board is going WAY overboard, and it seems to me that their reaction is completely out of proportion in regards to the offense. It's like shooting someone in the head for taking a bite out of your apple. They're effectively trying to ruin the kids life, and even get him removed from the country when he may have some serious potential. Quite frankly, their reaction is ridiculous and I hope that the parents win their lawsuit. However...they shouldn't take money from the school either...schools need that. The teacher does sound a bit lazy, I've had a few like that where they let "students guide the lessons" and it was usually a convenient excuse not to do work. Teachers need to GUIDE the students in the right direction and let the students discover things, not simply give them a text book and say "go." (I have a lot of teachers in the family) Someone should go pimp-slap the fool that made the decision to go after this kid so strongly. I don't know if it's racism or if they're just terrified that he got into the computer system. However, hacking into a teacher's personal account and looking at something (without making any changes) is not exactly dangerous to the rest of the school system computers. It's not like he could go in from there and format ever drive in the school. The teacher was obviously not using a strong password (as I'm sure he was instructed to do) and should be punished for that. My mom has a password for her computer account at school, and it has to be a "strong" password consisting of letters AND numbers. "Carl" is not a strong password, and it definitely seems odd that the password would be the name of the student who is now trying to get booted. Perhaps someone's embarrassed that a foreign visa-holding student is ranked 3rd in the school? I don't know, but it seems to me with that password there should be more investigation, and that teacher needs to be reprimanded for putting such a dumb password on in the first place. PS: Fatty, is this where you teach? Suspension/F in Class is a good punishment. Criminal charges is just silly agreed Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stutters May 2, 2007 Share stutters GC Alumni May 2, 2007 academic integrity is probably the most emphasized (and enforced) area of conduct at UST. cheating is cheating, and cheating nets you expulsion, not some lame 5 day suspension. the criminal charges are ridiculous, though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bubblegum Bandit May 2, 2007 Share Bubblegum Bandit Member May 2, 2007 http://www.cnn.com/2007/EDUCATION/05/01/du...s.ap/index.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stutters May 2, 2007 Share stutters GC Alumni May 2, 2007 from the hacking perspective: http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/artic...8-2005Mar8.html "...He was responding to Harvard's decision Monday to reject 119 applicants for following a hacker's instructions to visit the school's admissions site to get an early glimpse of acceptance decisions. Massachusetts Institute of Technology followed suit Tuesday, rejecting 32 applicants, and Carnegie Mellon University made a similar decision last week..." in other words, welcome to the real world, spud. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JackieChan May 2, 2007 Share JackieChan GC Alumni May 2, 2007 Sure, discipinary action should be enforced, but it should by no means be dubbed as something criminal. They viewed him as a security threat because the "teacher put up a trap for him"? If that trap theory is indeed true, then I'm not sure if the student should take 100% of the blame for everything. The teacher's teaching methods seemed pretty half-***ed, IMO. The student was sort of coaxed into doing that because he complained and no action what-so-ever was taken. Can't exactly blame someone for wanting to do good in a class when the teacher just sucks. But as SJ said, welcome to the real world. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ShadowDog May 2, 2007 Share ShadowDog Member May 2, 2007 I think the kid cheated.. That's cheating. Hacking is Hacking. but what the teacher did, is wrong as well.. both should be penalized. this isn't some world where the teachers are TRYING to get kids suspended, TEACHERS ARE SUPPOSE TO HELP THEIR STUDENTS! i'm trying to become a teacher and i would never refuse help to a student. plain and simple he is a bad teacher, and the kid cracked under pressure as well as cheated. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Playaa May 2, 2007 Share Playaa Member May 2, 2007 wait, I'm confused. According to the article it seems as if a website existed with POTENTIAL test questions that students could look at to assist them in studying. The teacher changed the password to the website so that students could no longer access it (which means they were allowed to access it at some point). This student asked a friend to help him figure out the new password at which point he examined the POTENTIAL test questions again and then studied and took the test (where he got a 95). Doesn't sound like cheating to me. He wasn't viewing the actual test nor was he viewing anything he wasn't allowed to see before. To me it sounds like he made a stupid decision and it also sounds like this teacher doesn't have his best interests in mind (probably because he was confronted about his possibly poor teaching methods. Unless there's something that wasn't explained properly...I'd say the student is being punished MUCH harder than is necessary. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stutters May 2, 2007 Share stutters GC Alumni May 2, 2007 imo, the best teacher i've ever had is the one who didn't teach more than 10% of the time. she provided direction in the classroom, but the majority of our learning was done through peer exchange. especially in an AP class, the students should be capable of covering the material on their own and then delivering it back to the students. being able to discuss your knowledge is the best demonstration of your comprehension. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZeroDamage May 2, 2007 Share ZeroDamage Member May 2, 2007 The student is at fault. He also broke the law by breaking into the teacher's computer. I am all for his punishment and the charges. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mookie May 2, 2007 Share mookie GC Alumni May 2, 2007 Sounds like the kid must've broken/snuck into the teacher's classroom/office at some point, and if the district has enough evidence then they may as well go for trespassing or breaking and entering. When I took AB computer science in high school, the teacher probably lectured even less than this guy, and she was one of the best teachers I've had. Just about everyone who took the exam got a 3 or better, yet I've met people from other high schools where most students couldn't get a 3 on that same exam. This kid needs to stop crying about how the teacher doesn't lecture. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stutters May 2, 2007 Share stutters GC Alumni May 2, 2007 wait, I'm confused.i read this over twice before my first post, and both times i was under the impression they accessed the teachers computer (remotely, since the kid who cracked it didn't even attend the school). i read it again, and i think you're right -- it could be either the website or the computer. in my first post i was going to pose the ethical question: what if the test was left on the teacher's desk, without a password, and he was caught taking down the questions? he wouldn't be breaking any computer use policies, but the dilemma is still the same. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sgt. Slaughterâ„¢-TopBrass May 2, 2007 Share Sgt. Slaughterâ„¢-TopBrass Member May 2, 2007 The punishment far exceeds the crime. I have no love for School Administrators or Boards... In my opinion they always have a chip on there shoulder, and don't get me started on Zero Tolerance (Tolerance = Zero Intelligence). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
[LaW]Maverick May 2, 2007 Share [LaW]Maverick Member May 2, 2007 Meh, looking at potential answers is not enough to get your life ruined. Simple as that. The punishment should fit the crime, and the criminal charges are ludicrous. Also, some of the better teachers I've had let the students lead the class, however, these good teachers NEVER, not once, refused to help in whatever way they could. Refusing to help a student means refusing to do your job. That's why you're in the classroom. If it was just accessing a website with a new password, then it wasn't exactly hacking. I mean, the kid couldn't alter anything, did not get into any personal records, did not attempt to alter anything, and did not gain access to any system through which he COULD alter anything. That's the impression I get after re-reading the article. It needs to be more clearly outlined. The whole password being "Carl" thing still really bothers me. It almost seems like the teacher was purposely trying to get him to fail, and mockingly popped the name in there. That's a stretch for sure, but why make the password "Carl?" I'd be interested to find out whether or not other students were refused help on the test. There needs to be more information. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
anonymo May 2, 2007 Share anonymo Member May 2, 2007 Depends on who is lying. Of course punishment is required for his actions if he actually hacked into this teachers computer (which the article doesn't state clearly depending on either side of the story). However if it is true that his teacher made it difficult if not impossible to get the extra help then I totally understand the entrapment aspect. This isn't to say that he should get off but that the punishment should be justified and spread to the teacher as well. If this student is punished to the full extent that the school board wishes it only means that any teacher can then go and arbitrarily "copy" this situation onto other students with whom they don't see eye to eye. I'm seeing more and more school incidents lately where the full weight of the law falls up the a student (by the school) before he/she is even given a fail trail (Rofl...I meant fair...I think I should leave that slip in tho...) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
farmerisme May 2, 2007 Share farmerisme Member May 2, 2007 Ok first of all I can attest that many, many high level courses have a teacher that guides the learning and uses the teaching techniques that this teacher did. That in of it self is not half-assed. Now the kid says he asked for help and was turned down. This is what he says. If it is true (which I personally doubt) the teacher should be disciplined. But if he was such a smart, good kid he would have found a way to learn the material. If he was floating one of the best GPA records in the school he was obviously bright enough to not need to be spoon fed the info. Sounds to me like the kid was under enough pressure from his family (or whomever) to keep his grades perfect. He took a chance without considering the consequences. I would have instantly given the kid a F for the class with a suspension as well. Most schools are VERY clear about what the punishments are for cheating. Criminal charges are just silly, IMO. So the kid made a big mistake that is going to change his life. Tough. Instead of trying to lay the blame for this on everyone else he should just deal with it. So some kid makes a bad choice and takes some drinks at a party and kills someone on his drive home, does he get a redo? No. Some one decides to have sex and gets his 14 yo girlfriend preggers? redo? Nope. Life is full of decisions. He made a very poor one. World needs ditch diggers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Metallurgic May 2, 2007 Share Metallurgic Member May 2, 2007 Suspension/F in Class is a good punishment. Criminal charges is just silly Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thief_Lord May 3, 2007 Share Thief_Lord Member May 3, 2007 LOL, we read about that in Journalism!!! The pasword being Carl STILL really bothers me though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
[LaW]Maverick May 3, 2007 Share [LaW]Maverick Member May 3, 2007 LOL, we read about that in Journalism!!! The pasword being Carl STILL really bothers me though. Exactly...that teacher should be under investigation at the very least...that seems a lil' malicious to me Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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