Watchtower December 31, 2003 Share Watchtower Member December 31, 2003 Does anyone have any links to sites that are good at explaining biblical truths like what Frank Peretti writes about? I'd like to read some. I'm broke and I don't have the cash to go buy a video or book.. I would also like a bible.. Can anyone spare one? Don't care which version as long as it's in english. I'll pay postage or soemthing.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Playaa December 31, 2003 Share Playaa Member December 31, 2003 (edited) if you don't mind an old junky one Watch...I have one I could spare you it's NIV by Zondervan and it's called the "Teen Study Bible" but you don't hafta pay attention to the "teen" stuff *edit* I'm gonna need to know where to send this Edited December 31, 2003 by Playaa/Pselus Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jane January 12, 2004 Share jane Member January 12, 2004 (edited) i got a few things for you watch. Bible: two different ones if you want books: Mere Christianity, by CS Lewis(dont own, but you can rent it a the library) The Case for Faith, by Lee Strobel websites: www.biblestudytools.net www.str.org www.apologeticsinfo.org particularly ---- this one---- from above website http://www.apologeticsinfo.org/papers/logi...postmodern.html anything else? Id send those books to you if I had an address... janeCrossWalk.comStand to Reason Edited January 12, 2004 by jane Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dwEEziL January 12, 2004 Share dwEEziL Member January 12, 2004 Online bible I like - Bible Gateway Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
auggybendoggy January 13, 2004 Share auggybendoggy Member January 13, 2004 watch take the C.S. Lewis stuff and the bibes bro... C.S. was extremely intell. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Watchtower January 13, 2004 Author Share Watchtower Member January 13, 2004 Got me a bible thanks to playaa.. I like the part about men ruling over women once married.. Sounds like a servant to me.. Interpretations? Women were made to "complete" man right? And thats what marriage is all about right? Not equal right? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dwEEziL January 13, 2004 Share dwEEziL Member January 13, 2004 When the Bible speaks of the woman being submissive to man, it doesn't mean the woman is a slave and at the whim of the man. IMO, it means that ultimately, the man is responsible for everything, responsible as in accountable not the man makes all decisions. It means the ultimate decisions are left up to the man, but again, IMO, these decisions the man makes should only be made after an agreement or at least discussion has taken place between the man and woman. It is really more of protection for the woman rather than giving the man rule over her. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Playaa January 13, 2004 Share Playaa Member January 13, 2004 Watch...I hear that all the time from people who only read the bible to disprove it...if you're doing that then you'll get no worth out of it... and on the same subject...people consistently read that part and totally ignore the part that talks about (to paraphrase) how a man should be treating his woman like the queen of the earth...so you put those two together...and you've got a great relationship. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Watchtower January 14, 2004 Author Share Watchtower Member January 14, 2004 When the Bible speaks of the woman being submissive to man, it doesn't mean the woman is a slave and at the whim of the man. IMO, it means that ultimately, the man is responsible for everything, responsible as in accountable not the man makes all decisions. It means the ultimate decisions are left up to the man, but again, IMO, these decisions the man makes should only be made after an agreement or at least discussion has taken place between the man and woman. It is really more of protection for the woman rather than giving the man rule over her. Explain? Dweeze, some women are going to take major offense to that.. All final answer on all subjects man is supposed to be responsible for in a relationship? Wow, do you have a girlfriend? Have you ever? And I don't see how that provides protection.. All I see is the fact that man is a better decision maker, or is more wise than the woman. And i dont mean to come out like someone who is just reading the bible to disprove it. I am interested in what all the fuss is about.. obviously it has a huge impact on ones life and I am intrigued. But I have to admit reading it now with my current opinion on things, it seems overly simplistic and not very encompassing.. It leaves alot to the imagination.. I don't know. I haven't read a whole lot yet.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ConGregation January 14, 2004 Share ConGregation Member January 14, 2004 It works. It works very well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dwEEziL January 14, 2004 Share dwEEziL Member January 14, 2004 (edited) If you want to take it as "the man has final say over any and all situations" fine, I never said that. I did say that all decisions should be made after an agreement or at least an adult conversation has been had between the two spouses. It's a hard thing to understand and if two people don't go into the relationship with an unselfish, unconditional love for the other person (or at least a willingness to strive for that) then this arrangement can and often does get abused. What Playaa said helps bind this together. If that love isn't there, then it can go bad quickly. Protection for the wife was meant in regards to no matter what occurs, ultimate responsibility falls on the man as the head of the household. Also, I take offense to your "girlfriend" comment but I forgive you for it. I can see someone not understanding exactly what I meant and taking it the wrong way. Edited January 14, 2004 by dwEEziL Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Watchtower January 14, 2004 Author Share Watchtower Member January 14, 2004 Ok, i see.. Well that makes sense, one should consult the other before making decisions. It definitely can make things run smoother, but not practical in all senses.. Some things one or the other will have no clue about, I guess discussion and teaching is the thing to do.. It dosen't always = happiness and contentment though. And you dilute your first statement by saying only an adult conversation.. Not necessarily leaving the decision to the man for some reason.. To say that in a marraige that both parties are on equal ground and both able to make decisions is one thing. Saying the man is the ultimate decision make is another.. Which is it? Rev, what works? Explain.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
auggybendoggy January 14, 2004 Share auggybendoggy Member January 14, 2004 (edited) watch, dude i fall more in the category of christians that says woman are equal even in descision making. The "man has the final say" is not what God is at all about. Its like playya said it's about LOVE. Some christians believe women should not be pastors...I say whatever When did God say women would serve men? Was it before the curse or after? It was after. Meaning before the women did not serve men. They were equals made to love one another and be bonded together in friendship. In the same passage it says men would plow the fields with the sweat of their brows. Does this mean that using ORTHO weed killer is a sin when farming? This is not the point God wants us to see. He wants us to see they were in love and bonded one to another. Those are my thoughts, (i know, i know im a liberal) Auggy Edited January 14, 2004 by auggybendoggy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dwEEziL January 14, 2004 Share dwEEziL Member January 14, 2004 I say both are equal. A marriage is a union of two into one so both are together in all actions that come out of it. The protection part comes down to, in my opinion, the man being ultimately responsible for those actions since God has placed him as the head of the household. Not really proper to call him a shepherd since the wife is in no way a sheep but rather an equal. It's hard for me to explain how I feel about this over the forums but Playaa did a good job in catching my heart for this. The woman is supposed to be the focus of adoration from the man,not as in worshiping her like he does God, but as putting her well-being and desires before his own and likewise goes for the female. Those should be the strong, motivating factors when decisions should be made. Most of the times, both will lead to the same decision for each spouse, but not always, that is when it comes down to loving one another and making the decision with both parties aware of why the decisions were made. Ok, I tend to ramble...hence why I can be confusing...sorry. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crowbar January 14, 2004 Share Crowbar Member January 14, 2004 You have to understand that this relationship only works when human selfishness is put aside. It's the selfishness in us all that makes this arrangement seem like it sucks. "Woman submissive to man? Heck no, I'll do what I want!" That's not what it's about. The passage only applies in a marriage where the man puts his wife's desires as more important than his own, and the wife reciprocates. Thus, when both are constantly (okay, it's never "constantly") striving to love the other best they can, when they truly are one person, then there is no jealousy from the woman. God appointed man as the head of the house, he is the one ultimately accountable for the actions of his wife, children and himself. Also, the two most important words for a man to learn are "yes dear." There's a balance. We all know that women of today (and I don't think it has been much different, even in Jesus' time) have definate opinions, and they usually don't hesitate to tell you when you're doing something they think is wrong. I think the only time this passage really comes into play in a relationship, is when there is an argument and the man is convicted, and firmly believing before God that he is in the right, and "puts his foot down." That would, of course, only be on something life changing, maybe a big move, a split from a church, something that matters. Basically, it says that you, as a man and the head of your house, are the one that God will ask questions of most. God's not giving men lordship over their wife, free reign to do as they please, ignoring the desires of their wife. On the subject of reading material: The Bible should be your first priority, read it and try to figure out what it's saying yourself. Yes, it is simple in many aspects. What is the need for a complex relationship. The whole of the Christian message is summed up in a simple statement. God desires the love and friendship of his people, no matter how much one curses His name, the Lord always loves us as our father and will wrap his arms around us if only we come to him, realizing that we have wronged him, and ready to accept his payment for our sins. I would also echo the recommendation to read C.S. Lewis's books, any of them are wonderful, but Mere Christianity would probably suite you best. I'll mail you my copy, if you'll read it. Lewis was an athiest, and an intellectual. He set out to prove there was no God. The more information he collected, the more he was convinced that God was real, and that what was in the Bible was indeed true. Mere Christianity uses pure human intellect to examine, and prove, that there must be a God, and then discoveres what this God must be like. It's an easy book to read, at heart Lewis loved fantasy, and he is as good at writing entertaining novels or even humor, as he is at writing more serious intellectual works. There is scarecly a difference. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fatty February 3, 2004 Share Fatty GC Founder February 3, 2004 Did Watchtower ever receive a Bible? *nvmd, I went back and read. scuse. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Watchtower February 4, 2004 Author Share Watchtower Member February 4, 2004 yeah I kinda peterd out halfway through genesis.. Too many generations to digest at once I pick it up here and there. Working, I have some downtime between calls once in a while.. It's in my truck. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Playaa February 4, 2004 Share Playaa Member February 4, 2004 it's not like a novel that you must read from start to finish... find a section and just read it...pick a book here and there.... I suggest Romans, Acts, Hebrews, James, 1st, 2nd, 3rd John... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jane February 4, 2004 Share jane Member February 4, 2004 yar, and try out Job and the Gospels. Psalms are fun, and I think you would find Proverbs/Ecclesiastes rather fun. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soul .gc February 4, 2004 Share soul .gc Member February 4, 2004 What you have to remember about women is that originally God told Adam he was going to take his Right Arm and Leg to make him a companion....Adam did not like this so he asked; "What can I get for a rib?" haha - made me laugh the other day. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Watchtower February 4, 2004 Author Share Watchtower Member February 4, 2004 Lol Soul. Um on the bible.. I'd say it's pretty important to read Genesis straight thru no? Revelation? I realize alot of it is mix and match but aren't those parts chronologically important? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Playaa February 4, 2004 Share Playaa Member February 4, 2004 well yeah...I meant you didn't need to read the Bible from Genesis to Revelation...as you would a novel...but you should keep books in context. the first few books of the Bible can be a bit...daunting...especially Numbers... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Watchtower February 4, 2004 Author Share Watchtower Member February 4, 2004 Yeah everything has to have an exact number.. Is that what you're talking about? Like I'm supposed to be awed that God gave Abraham 6000 donkies? I mean 6000 donkies is pretty impressive, but what would you do with 6000 donkies?? Is that really a gift? He must have had some serious land.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
[VI]ROosTEr February 5, 2004 Share [VI]ROosTEr Member February 5, 2004 Lol Soul. Um on the bible.. I'd say it's pretty important to read Genesis straight thru no? Revelation? I realize alot of it is mix and match but aren't those parts chronologically important? A lot of the Bible is out of chronological order too. Luckily, I have a student bible that frequently references me to earlier books. I read the Bible like a novel, and quite frankly was bored by most of it because it wasn't meant to be great literature. I find a study approach much more enjoyable for most of it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bubblegum Bandit February 5, 2004 Share Bubblegum Bandit Member February 5, 2004 Playaa and Dweez, I think the verse you are looking for is in Ephesians....Husbands, love your wives as Christ loved the church. It does say wives submit to your husbands. I take it as has been said, the male should take the leading role in the relationship, but this doesn't mean he can do what he pleases, where would the loving your wife come into that? I take it as guys, take care of your families, provide for them in the ways you can, and wives, take care of your family, provide for them the way YOU can. In my bible study we have been talking a lot about Grace and what exactly it is, kinda makes me think of it when we talk about this, "Give grace to each other." I'm rambling now, but hopefully it helps some. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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