anonymo February 13, 2007 Share anonymo Member February 13, 2007 Vienna! is slated for a 2009 release...pfft...vista is for old people! I wonder when the beta starts? Thanks for becoming Apple, Microsoft Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dj_ February 13, 2007 Share dj_ Member February 13, 2007 I have every intention right now to skip Vista. I'm a systems engineer who works primarily with Windows 2k/2k3 adv, redhat and ubuntu, but I cannot bring myself to buy an operating system that will control my system against my wishes. Among them are some serious functionality degredations and I highly recommend folks pay very close to the next 3 to 6 months on what Microsoft attempts to do. Here's a link to a daily blog by one of the security industry's brightest, Bruce Schneier, about this sort of thing. Why Vista's DRM is bad for you You can also visit his site, Bruce Schneier's Weblog, for more thoughts on security that goes well beyond information technology into the full spectrum of security in our world. I highly recommend it. -dj Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
anonymo February 13, 2007 Author Share anonymo Member February 13, 2007 I got about 2 paragraphs in and puke'd a little in my mouth...looks like I'm going to pick up a legit copy of XP for now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boiler February 13, 2007 Share boiler Member February 13, 2007 Alright, here's my take on all this nonsense: Never pay attention to the raving fanboys of anything. Never pay attention to the doomsday predictors and trash talkers. Take all the garbage these two groups say, put them together, look somewhere in the middle, and there's the reality of it all. That guy does make some valid points about DRM, but I think a lot of it was exaggerated and he was making some pretty big leaps to conclusions. I'm not going to NOT buy something (double negative, I know) because some liberal whack-job is screaming at me not to. I have Vista running on this laptop, not because I was anxious to upgrade to it but because I ordered it from Dell after they switched to Vista. I don't think Vista is a great deal different functionally than XP, at least for what I need it for. I also know that it's not the satanic evil operating system some are making it out to be. I like the visual and organizational changes they made. Not thrilled about hardware usage up to this point. The security warnings are a little annoying, but that can be worked on. The dang OS has been out for all of two weeks, give it some time before calling for a boycott and searching for copies of XP on the black market in two months. my two cents anyways Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dj_ February 13, 2007 Share dj_ Member February 13, 2007 Yeah, I did too. Not as much as when I read how they were going to limit the number of activations you can do (was 2). So you could install it once, change a processor, have to "re-activate" and now if you change the motherboard, you have to buy a new license. This has been changed a bit, but they were really going to screw the general public... Anyway, I know I'll have to have one one day for gaming, I'm ready to accept that, but ANYTHING else that I can do elsewhere, as in on Ubuntu, Fedora, etc., I will. -dj Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cujo February 13, 2007 Share Cujo Member February 13, 2007 i'm probably going to end up buying the retail version so if they ever decided to enforce the one activation rule on oem copies i'll be in the clear. that and retail allows you to swap between 32 and 64 bit where as oem is whichever you buy and that's it. retail is cheaper than 32 bit and 64 bit oem combined. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cujo February 13, 2007 Share Cujo Member February 13, 2007 just read the article and noticed firefox blocking a popup for the website it's on. no longer can i take this guy seriously. the thing with that article is that drm isn't stopping people from downloading and watching illegal content. if it's ever not watchable it won't be downloadable. the only thing we as users will notice is the extra cpu cycles he mentioned but i don't think you'd be able to benchmark any difference with or without that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Z3RO February 13, 2007 Share Z3RO Member February 13, 2007 WOOOOO ALMOST TIME FOR ME TO UPGRADE TO XP PRO Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheReverend(c) February 13, 2007 Share TheReverend(c) Member February 13, 2007 I have every intention right now to skip Vista. I'm a systems engineer who works primarily with Windows 2k/2k3 adv, redhat and ubuntu, but I cannot bring myself to buy an operating system that will control my system against my wishes. Among them are some serious functionality degredations and I highly recommend folks pay very close to the next 3 to 6 months on what Microsoft attempts to do. Here's a link to a daily blog by one of the security industry's brightest, Bruce Schneier, about this sort of thing. Why Vista's DRM is bad for you You can also visit his site, Bruce Schneier's Weblog, for more thoughts on security that goes well beyond information technology into the full spectrum of security in our world. I highly recommend it. -dj I fully agree Dj. Actually we should just wait till microsofts newest os in oh 2025. DRM BADDDD!!! Way to blow it microsoft way to blow it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ShadowDog February 13, 2007 Share ShadowDog Member February 13, 2007 (edited) i r scared! i pirate software, music, videos, basically everything on my computer is pirated... x.x i might have to go legit! oh noes! Basically i wont get vista because i don't have the money and i somewhat think i will get my laptop for college as a macintosh. Simple, and not as screwed up as Windows. but for my desktop, it will remain Windows based for gaming. Edited February 13, 2007 by ShadowDog Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NOFX February 13, 2007 Share NOFX Member February 13, 2007 just read the article and noticed firefox blocking a popup for the website it's on. no longer can i take this guy seriously. Now thats an interesting way to determine whether you take a site seriously or not... CNN Fox News Are you still reading the news paper? JK man The thought of buying Vista has never even crossed my mind. My friend has a microsoft development license and hooked me up with the retail ultimate version a while back. I uninstalled it a day later... Real men use debian with fluxbox installed Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cujo February 13, 2007 Share Cujo Member February 13, 2007 just read the article and noticed firefox blocking a popup for the website it's on. no longer can i take this guy seriously. Now thats an interesting way to determine whether you take a site seriously or not... CNN Fox News Are you still reading the news paper? JK man i didn't realize it was forbes but even still i don't think he knows much other than what he's paid to know. i trust people telling me things that they aren't paid to know but they know cause they want to. less corruption that way. i do find it ironic that a guy writing an article about annoying cpu resource hogging drm has it posted on a site that causes cpu usage by giving pop up ads. if you want to know about pc stuff read enthusiast sites. they know far more about tech stuff then big wig authors paid to write articles. shadow, mac is far worse than pc. they have their own browser and e-mail clients and all the stuff people complain about with microsoft monopolies mac does even worse. they don't even let you choose what hardware to install it on. just remember, you can install vista on a mac but you can't install osx on a pc. i wonder why that is... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NOFX February 13, 2007 Share NOFX Member February 13, 2007 (edited) i didn't realize it was forbes but even still i don't think he knows much other than what he's paid to know. i trust people telling me things that they aren't paid to know but they know cause they want to. less corruption that way. i do find it ironic that a guy writing an article about annoying cpu resource hogging drm has it posted on a site that causes cpu usage by giving pop up ads. if you want to know about pc stuff read enthusiast sites. they know far more about tech stuff then big wig authors paid to write articles. indeed.. or you could have the hardware/software knowledge and experience to understand a majority of the stuff just by using the system and it will cut the other man out all together... Sure Vista hogs my memory..takes up 522 on startup to be exact(for my machine)... Does this guy know that many services and background apps are built into the kernel which means they are already loaded into the memory, thus cutting down on load time for the application? I haven't read the article.. but probably not..... Edited February 13, 2007 by NOFX Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tracid February 13, 2007 Share Tracid Member February 13, 2007 Will there be a DirectX 10 for XP? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bushwack February 14, 2007 Share bushwack Member February 14, 2007 No Vista for me until there is a reason for it. I haven't even been using XP for 3 years and didn't need it then over 98se. I imaging maybe in the near future getting Vista but not until the smoke clears and 2gigs of RAM is the price of 1 today. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Primus February 14, 2007 Share Primus Member February 14, 2007 I agree with most of these post, although i didn't even read all of them. However, you guys are missing one important aspect of Vista when it comes to the rest of the public. ( by that I mean most everyone else who isn't as advanced about pc's as most people here ) That one major aspect is this----to John Q public----ITS REALLY PRETTY AND COOL LOOKING!!!! And thats the bottom line when it comes to people that don't know any better. So for you programers out there, and those of you who do Tech support on the side---you might as well get use to the fact that your going to have to figure some of it out just so you can fix your 65 year old neihbor's first computer when it can't get to the internet. Oh ya, BTW---the internet is very quickly becomeing the only place where you can get a copy of Windows XP. Most of your big chain electronics stores are shoving Vista in everyones face. They have taken XP off the shelves, just go to your local Circuit City and Best Buy and ask for a copy of XP, any copy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Metallurgic February 14, 2007 Share Metallurgic Member February 14, 2007 Luckily I got a copy of XP Pro w/ sp2 for $20.00 from my college. I'll wait until April when they carry Vista Ultimate. Why another OS? Is it just a different version of Vista? It sounds like they just added a few features and called it a different name. Anyhow, it's probably just a rumor. Even MS wouldn't do something that ignorant. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kruten February 14, 2007 Share Kruten Member February 14, 2007 As long as it doesn't turn into another 2000/ME scenario, doesn't matter to me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheGeek February 14, 2007 Share TheGeek Member February 14, 2007 WOOOOO ALMOST TIME FOR ME TO UPGRADE TO XP PRO Got mine for 3.50 LEGAL! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cujo February 14, 2007 Share Cujo Member February 14, 2007 (edited) Sure Vista hogs my memory..takes up 522 on startup to be exact(for my machine)... Does this guy know that many services and background apps are built into the kernel which means they are already loaded into the memory, thus cutting down on load time for the application? I haven't read the article.. but probably not..... vista actually uses all of your memory, all of the time. which is actually better. don't know if i posted this already somewhere but here it is again. if you haven't read it then i highly recommend you give it a read. at least read the page posted and the following page as well. i've read all 19 pages. some excellent info in there. http://www.anandtech.com/systems/showdoc.aspx?i=2917&p=3 Edited February 14, 2007 by Cujo Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
anonymo February 14, 2007 Author Share anonymo Member February 14, 2007 Now thats an interesting way to determine whether you take a site seriously or not... CNN Fox News Neither of those sites are credible yet one has pop-ups and the other doesn't...I'm confused. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
appalachian_fox February 14, 2007 Share appalachian_fox Member February 14, 2007 ...However, you guys are missing one important aspect of Vista when it comes to the rest of the public. ( by that I mean most everyone else who isn't as advanced about pc's as most people here ) That one major aspect is this----to John Q public----ITS REALLY PRETTY AND COOL LOOKING!!!! ... Oh ya, BTW---the internet is very quickly becomeing the only place where you can get a copy of Windows XP. Most of your big chain electronics stores are shoving Vista in everyones face. They have taken XP off the shelves, just go to your local Circuit City and Best Buy and ask for a copy of XP, any copy. For what it's worth, I'd say the second point is what's really going to matter to the rest of the public. As anecdotal evidence, I humbly submit that I know several people who buy a new operating system every time one comes out because it's pretty and cool-looking: They own Macs. The rest of the people I know don't buy operating systems, they buy computers with Windows installed. How many of the John Q. Public crowd will upgrade in the coming year, and how many of them will buy from a large retailer of some sort who only sell Vista PCs? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NOFX February 14, 2007 Share NOFX Member February 14, 2007 Now thats an interesting way to determine whether you take a site seriously or not... CNN Fox News Neither of those sites are credible yet one has pop-ups and the other doesn't...I'm confused. both had pop ups for me... and CNN has never given me a reason to find it biased or uncredible Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NOFX February 14, 2007 Share NOFX Member February 14, 2007 Sure Vista hogs my memory..takes up 522 on startup to be exact(for my machine)... Does this guy know that many services and background apps are built into the kernel which means they are already loaded into the memory, thus cutting down on load time for the application? I haven't read the article.. but probably not..... vista actually uses all of your memory, all of the time. which is actually better. don't know if i posted this already somewhere but here it is again. if you haven't read it then i highly recommend you give it a read. at least read the page posted and the following page as well. i've read all 19 pages. some excellent info in there. http://www.anandtech.com/systems/showdoc.aspx?i=2917&p=3 I read the first few pages, but didnt see anything related to Vista using all your memory... Im not sure if get what you mean. If Vista is using all of my memory all of the time, then when you load Counter-strike, wouldn't it be stored in a (slow as balls) page-file on your hard drive since it can't be stored in all of the memory? I go to task manager and I have 1.47 gigs free and 522 Megs being used. If your saying Vista is a memory manager and decides what application to allocate memory to, any decent OS has been doing this since Windows 3.1. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cujo February 14, 2007 Share Cujo Member February 14, 2007 (edited) Sure Vista hogs my memory..takes up 522 on startup to be exact(for my machine)... Does this guy know that many services and background apps are built into the kernel which means they are already loaded into the memory, thus cutting down on load time for the application? I haven't read the article.. but probably not..... vista actually uses all of your memory, all of the time. which is actually better. don't know if i posted this already somewhere but here it is again. if you haven't read it then i highly recommend you give it a read. at least read the page posted and the following page as well. i've read all 19 pages. some excellent info in there. http://www.anandtech.com/systems/showdoc.aspx?i=2917&p=3 I read the first few pages, but didnt see anything related to Vista using all your memory... Im not sure if get what you mean. If Vista is using all of my memory all of the time, then when you load Counter-strike, wouldn't it be stored in a (slow as balls) page-file on your hard drive since it can't be stored in all of the memory? I go to task manager and I have 1.47 gigs free and 522 Megs being used. If your saying Vista is a memory manager and decides what application to allocate memory to, any decent OS has been doing this since Windows 3.1. you see 522megs being used cause people are stupid and were scared when vista was showing all memory used. it did this in at least one of the release candidates i used. even i questioned it but the performance was there so i said ok who cares. task manager no longer shows it using all the memory. it just shows memory used by programs currently active. this is taken from page 4 of my link: "Vista keeps track of what memory pages are frequently requested and what files they are tied to, and based on that data SuperFetch will populate as much free memory as it can with pages it believes you will need in the future." basically, that says vista uses all your memory all the time. this taken from just above my first quote: "As we've already explained, the premise behind SuperFetch is simple - it's an intelligent software mechanism that monitors frequently used pages and does its best to keep them in memory. In other words if you run Photoshop a lot, SuperFetch will take notice and try to keep Photoshop.exe and its associated libraries in main memory so long as you don't need that memory for anything else. The real world impact of SuperFetch is tremendous: the more memory you have, the more your frequently used applications will load very quickly." so if you have, say 4gb install, vista should be able to preload hl2.exe and start times should be VERY fast. also, the longer you use vista the faster it will become loading commonly used programs. lastly: "SuperFetch works like this: Vista will load anything it needs to load in memory first, and any applications you manually run will also be loaded into memory. Any memory left over is fair game to be used by SuperFetch as a cache of frequently used pages. Vista keeps track of what memory pages are frequently requested and what files they are tied to, and based on that data SuperFetch will populate as much free memory as it can with pages it believes you will need in the future. This data contains both frequency and temporal history, so not only how often but when you run these applications will influence what SuperFetch does at any given time." that's all from page 4. i linked starting at page three so people could see memory requirements of vista. Edited February 14, 2007 by Cujo Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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